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Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Historical Events & Eras > Vietnam War

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Vietnam War The Battle for Vietnam. .

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  #31  
Old 04 Sep 09, 16:51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KEN JENSEN View Post
As for Altus, I'm sure his definition of "civilians" is probably a little different than mine (e.g. NLF folks to me were not civilians - but I would bet that Altus feels they were civilians).
Not necessarily. The PLAF (full time soldiers) surely were no civilians. The local supporters/cadres of the NLF that were unarmed were civilians. Those locals who were carrying arms and actively engaged in combat with your side, well I'm a little half-hearted here. Whilst carrying arms or actively engaging in combat activities, they definitely weren't civilians. But I think they should not be considered combatants while unarmed and not engaging in any combat activities, but can be subjects to apprehension and trials. I also understand that sometimes the line could be hard to draw, but that's what I think on this issue.


Quote:
I do believe that Altus may have to struggle more and dig more in order for him to contribute GOOD DEEDS performed by “his side”. Hell it was tough enough for those fighters to get enough supplies for their own needs, let alone supplies and construction equipment for them to do the GOOD DEEDS that “our side” could, and did do!
You're right on here, Ken! Sincerely appreciate your fair understanding.

Best wishes,

Altus
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  #32  
Old 04 Sep 09, 20:03
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Quote:
Originally Posted by altus View Post

You're right on here, Ken! Sincerely appreciate your fair understanding.

Best wishes,

Altus
Another point of Agreement.

Gary McKay is about to publish yet another Vietnam title.

With Healing Hands


It tells the story of more good guys. 450 Australian Doctors and Nurses who volunteered to go to Vietnam in the 60's and 70's to treat Vietnamese Civilians

They are now lobbying to receive the same benefits and entitlements as Military Veterans


I say fair enough

Cheers

Mick
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  #33  
Old 04 Sep 09, 21:04
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Mick,
These were "civilians" not "soldiers". The description follows:

Quote:
Early in the Vietnam War the South Vietnamese government appealed to the United States and its allies, including Australia, for desperately needed medical help. Most of the country's doctors had been conscripted into the army and the civilian population was facing a medical crisis.
From October 1964 until the end of 1972 over 450 surgeons, nurses and other medical specialists from Australian hospitals volunteered to work in South Vietnam.
If these were U.S. folks, they wouldn't be eligible for Military Benefits - don't think Aussie Govt will award them Military Benefits either.

I do believe this posting of yours in the TANK thread does qualify for this thread:http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forum...ks#post1299639

Believe this water source did aid the villagers and, yes, possibly even any NLF folks within the village.

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Last edited by KEN JENSEN; 04 Sep 09 at 21:11..
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  #34  
Old 04 Sep 09, 21:36
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Thanks Ken

On that basis this bloke qualifies as one of the ‘Good Guys’





Being associated with a unit not involved in the Army’s core business of killing people was no impediment to Peter Gration’s career. He went on to be Chief of the Defence force from 87 to 93.


Cheers

Mick
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  #35  
Old 05 Sep 09, 02:16
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I was requested and acted as interpreter between the US Army Corps of Engineers and Navy Seabees a few times when they were making improvements to roads, building bridges and schools at rural villages.
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  #36  
Old 05 Sep 09, 05:42
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Harshly criticised in some quarters for being a Anti-Communist Catholic propagandist. (Seth Jacobs)

Criticised from the opposite quarter for being "A friend of Dorothy"

Thomas Anthony Dooley III made a huge contribution to the humanitarian effort in Vietnam at a time when it was sorely needed.

He was a Sailor not a soldier, but I don't suppose that matters.

Cheers

Mick.

PS TB you are still a bad man
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  #37  
Old 05 Sep 09, 07:13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chippymick View Post
...He was a Sailor not a soldier, but I don't suppose that matters....
Doesn't matter, Sailor is Military; however I believe his time frame is really pre-"American War" time period. Let's try and stay within the time frame of say, Aug 1964 (Gulf of Tonkin incident), and the fall of Saigon (Apr 1975).

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  #38  
Old 05 Sep 09, 07:37
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"Pictures are worth a thousand words". Here's one of a quickly set-up temporary Aide Station within a Village in late 1967 or 1968.





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  #39  
Old 05 Sep 09, 08:05
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It's your train set Ken.

But there really was only one war. 1945-1975.

The French may have had the deeds to it in 1945 but title transferred to the US in 1954. The US went guarantor on the mortgage in 1950.

Vietnam, North and South, Laos and Cambodia were all part of the same deal.

Ho and Giap knew this.

Just saying that's all.

Should Roger Donlon give his MOH back?


Should James Thompson no longer be cosidered the Longest serving US POW of the war?


Should Operation White Star be ignored as an inconvenient truth?


Should Peter Dewey have his name on the wall?

Just saying...

Cheers

Mick
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  #40  
Old 05 Sep 09, 11:30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chippymick View Post
It's your train set Ken.

But there really was only one war. 1945-1975.

The French may have had the deeds to it in 1945 but title transferred to the US in 1954. The US went guarantor on the mortgage in 1950.

Vietnam, North and South, Laos and Cambodia were all part of the same deal.

Ho and Giap knew this.

Just saying that's all.

Should Roger Donlon give his MOH back?


Should James Thompson no longer be cosidered the Longest serving US POW of the war?


Should Operation White Star be ignored as an inconvenient truth?


Should Peter Dewey have his name on the wall?

Just saying...

Cheers

Mick
Oh, c'mon, Mick. Stop counting the angels on the head of the pin. Ken is trying to keep this simple. Call it the "American War", if you must - but we're talking about the period popularly thought of as the "War" in most media coverage - which included the coverage that Ken is trying to counter. Besides, this is about charity and humanity, not historical perfectionism.

I leave you with my old chestnut in this regard -



Cheers.

-- RR
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  #41  
Old 05 Sep 09, 14:58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RadioResearcher View Post
Oh, c'mon, Mick. Stop counting the angels on the head of the pin. Ken is trying to keep this simple. Call it the "American War", if you must - but we're talking about the period popularly thought of as the "War" in most media coverage - which included the coverage that Ken is trying to counter. Besides, this is about charity and humanity, not historical perfectionism.

Cheers.

-- RR
I believe that RR is correct here (thanks bud). Further, I feel that this "main" Vietnam War forum, with its multiple threads, has somewhat strayed from the time period it was intended for. For example, threads started here that probably should have been placed in other "Sticky" threads that are offered (eg. "Sticky" threads within the Vietnam War's main thread include the following:

Quote:
U.S. Army Campaigns of the Vietnam War
The U.S. Army's participation in the Vietnam Conflict is divided in 17 campaigns from 15 March 1962 to 28 January 1973. Here's an overview of each of them that provides a very good summary on every phases of the War.
http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forum...ad.php?t=66848


and on 19 Mar 05 Boonierat created this thread:
Quote:
40 years today - A Vietnam War Timeline
Just realised today that it was forty years (on March 8th) that the first two Marines battalions landed at Da Nang: BLT 3/9 came ashore at 0900 on Red Beach 2 and two hours later BLT 1/3 was flown it directly from Okinawa. This is generally recognized as the start of the "big unit" war. A few days earlier, Operation Rolling Thunder had begun (on March 2), this was the beginning of 8 years of massive US engagement in VN:
http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forum...ad.php?t=24341)
I, personally am not interested in the period 1945-1954 and or time frames before that even. However, have never "bitiched" about it; after all this is indeed a History Forum and I will let Bonnierat decide on where things should be. Also, not interested in the periods before the "Tonkin Gulf" incident (even though I have enjoyed some of the posts, but very few of them). Again, just my $0.02 worth.


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  #42  
Old 06 Sep 09, 07:48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KEN JENSEN View Post
I believe that RR is correct here (thanks bud). Further, I feel that this "main" Vietnam War forum, with its multiple threads, has somewhat strayed from the time period it was intended for. For example, threads started here that probably should have been placed in other "Sticky" threads that are offered (eg. "Sticky" threads within the Vietnam War's main thread include the following:







and on 19 Mar 05 Boonierat created this thread:


I, personally am not interested in the period 1945-1954 and or time frames before that even. However, have never "bitiched" about it; after all this is indeed a History Forum and I will let Bonnierat decide on where things should be. Also, not interested in the periods before the "Tonkin Gulf" incident (even though I have enjoyed some of the posts, but very few of them). Again, just my $0.02 worth.




You were condemned to repeat it and you never knew why.

58,000 of you never came home.

Quite depressing really.

Cheers

Mick.
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  #43  
Old 07 Sep 09, 08:59
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  #44  
Old 07 Sep 09, 09:57
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KEN JENSEN is a glorious beacon of light [700]
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Because of Copyright restrictions I provide the following link of a pic showing Aussie compassion and GOOD DEEDS: http://pro.corbis.com/Enlargement/En...&caller=search


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  #45  
Old 07 Sep 09, 11:41
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Oh my, I love this one - very touching!

http://pro.corbis.com/Enlargement/En...&caller=search



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