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Spy Wars Reconnaissance, deception and intelligence are all vital aspects of warfare, ancient and modern - discuss these aspects here!

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  #61  
Old 19 Mar 12, 07:29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Connolly View Post
The study of UFO studiers is, I find, far more interesting and amusing than UFOs themselves ...
Some of the folks at the Psych department at Purdue would agree with you.
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  #62  
Old 13 Nov 12, 09:32
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I would first suspect, that some people had been eating a few too many peyote cactus. But technically speaking: are we so sure that the limits of science are what the Heisenberg principle of Uncertainty dictates? It is possible to detect individual atoms on a crystal surface by a form of piezoelectricity.

The theory of science right now, centres on electromagnetism, as a central foundation. Nuclear science is explained based on electromagnetic theory. gravity is relatively weak. But we do not have a theory which would allow us to go deeper into matter. String theory is being questioned at present, experiments have brought data which confounds the string theory. Could other worlds have developed farther than we have? Interesting question.
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Last edited by Nickuru; 13 Nov 12 at 09:36.. Reason: addition
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  #63  
Old 13 Nov 12, 10:46
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Time will tell what really happened.
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  #64  
Old 05 Dec 12, 17:26
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It Could Have Been A Product Of Us Offensive Counter Intelligence Or The Government At The Time Didn't Want People Knowing The Truth So The Covered It Up With A Fatally Flawed Alien Hoax Story Which Would Have Caused Immediate Panic In The Us At That Time
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  #65  
Old 05 Dec 12, 18:05
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It Could Have Been A Product Of Us Offensive Counter Intelligence Or The Government At The Time Didn't Want People Knowing The Truth So The Covered It Up With A Fatally Flawed Alien Hoax Story Which Would Have Caused Immediate Panic In The Us At That TimeŽ
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Old 11 Dec 12, 06:38
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I must alert everyone here to the end of the world according to the Mayan calendar predicted at the winter solstice on December 21st. This event exceeds the Millenium 2000 event.

The solstice coincides with the alignment of the galactic centre of the Milky Way galaxy, the Sun and Earth. Also Venus, Earth and the Sun are aligned at this time. I must consult my astrologer! I will prepare beers and libations to chase away these evil spirits.
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  #67  
Old 14 Jan 13, 22:56
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Prior to his death, Haupt, Press/PA Officer at Roswell, claimed his weather balloon release was false. Such is claim here;
http://entertainment.msn.com/videopr...e-dcd277eb007f
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  #68  
Old 15 Jan 13, 07:55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G David Bock View Post
Prior to his death, Haupt, Press/PA Officer at Roswell, claimed his weather balloon release was false. Such is claim here;
http://entertainment.msn.com/videopr...e-dcd277eb007f
Actually, he was senile and quite befuddled at the time. He pretty much agreed with whatever he was asked. Easy to manipulate a sick old man to keep the UFO industry alive.
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  #69  
Old 15 Jan 13, 17:30
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Ironically, I watched the Apollo 11 moon landing in Roswell, NM in July of 1969 while visiting friends of the family there and it was the first time I was allowed to stay up past midnight.

That was as close to stories about space anyone in Roswell discussed until the release of the countless government conspiracy plots of the post Watergate era.

The release of the Project Mogul photographs in the 1990s perfectly matched the legitimate descriptions of the original stories.
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  #70  
Old 19 Jun 14, 15:15
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During my time in the US Air Force I actually spent a couple of years working at Area 51...not on UFOs or aliens but on regular old secret 'black' weapons systems. The base was built for these types of projects, so that there could be a place for aircraft etc to fly around without the general public seeing what was happening, and for good reasons. One example was the F-117 when it was still a 'black' project: you couldn't very well fly them in view of the public without making it pretty obvious that one of the keys to stealth technology was in the shape itself. There are lots of reasons that military technology needs to be kept classified...not because there's some evil government conspiracy but because if you tell everyone your secret projects they won't be secret anymore, and the value of having them disappears.
Area 51 is visible on Google maps by anyone, so it's not as much a secret installation as it was when I worked there, so I have told people from time to time that I worked there (of course I didn't do that until it became publicly acknowledged that the place even existed). Even though people believe that I worked there and had pretty thorough knowledge of the place, and I've told them there isn't any alien tech or creatures there, they still believe the stories they've read before they would believe me. I had first hand knowledge and they didn't, yet they persisted in believing the stories even though they are inherently less believable in the first place. There's nothing you can do with some people, is my point. They will believe whatever they want and if you give them as much proof as you can they'll say you omitted the truth and they'll believe in the information that doesn't exist before they believe in the facts. Either you agree with them or you're lying or covering up, and there's no way you can defeat this type of illogic.
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  #71  
Old 19 Jun 14, 15:24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rojik View Post
It's not a bad theory really. The CIA (or was it OSS then?) certainly came up with some wacky plans over the years and and if spreading the idea that the USA had access to that sort of technology might have helped give the USSR a good dose of paranoia and made them think twice about picking a fight.

The problem was that all of that fell apart with the Sputnik.

All that said I think it was just people getting carried away.
Having driven through Roswell without buying any 'souvenirs, I blame the Roswell chamber of commerce.

Great cottage industry...
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  #72  
Old 19 Jun 14, 16:22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve573 View Post
During my time in the US Air Force I actually spent a couple of years working at Area 51...not on UFOs or aliens but on regular old secret 'black' weapons systems. The base was built for these types of projects, so that there could be a place for aircraft etc to fly around without the general public seeing what was happening, and for good reasons. One example was the F-117 when it was still a 'black' project: you couldn't very well fly them in view of the public without making it pretty obvious that one of the keys to stealth technology was in the shape itself. There are lots of reasons that military technology needs to be kept classified...not because there's some evil government conspiracy but because if you tell everyone your secret projects they won't be secret anymore, and the value of having them disappears.
Area 51 is visible on Google maps by anyone, so it's not as much a secret installation as it was when I worked there, so I have told people from time to time that I worked there (of course I didn't do that until it became publicly acknowledged that the place even existed). Even though people believe that I worked there and had pretty thorough knowledge of the place, and I've told them there isn't any alien tech or creatures there, they still believe the stories they've read before they would believe me. I had first hand knowledge and they didn't, yet they persisted in believing the stories even though they are inherently less believable in the first place. There's nothing you can do with some people, is my point. They will believe whatever they want and if you give them as much proof as you can they'll say you omitted the truth and they'll believe in the information that doesn't exist before they believe in the facts. Either you agree with them or you're lying or covering up, and there's no way you can defeat this type of illogic.
IIRC, it was over towards the Groom lake/S4 area where claims of the UFOs were stashed.

Back between 2004 to 2005 my oldest son was in Iraq, Baghdad, with the 1st Cav. operating out of a FOB known as Camp War Eagle, on the NW side of Sadr City. The locals often mentioned a basement prisonand torture chambers there from Saddam's days, but 1st Armor, the prior occupiers never found such and so it was believed to just be rumor the locals were spreading. Part way thru his TOD there was some renovation and construction being done tot he FOB and guess what was found, blood stained walls,floors,and all?

There was also the time they were doing their HUMVEE patrol in the farmlands outside the city's edge and bumped into the turret of a buried tank. Found about a dozen plus of them. The story never got the press of the fighter jets and attack choppers buried in the sands on the edges of an Iraqi airbase.

Point is, one can be somewhere and still not encounter all that might be there.

That aside, no denying that the primary reason for Area 51 was for "skunk works" projects and that would be the vast majority of what was going on there.
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Last edited by G David Bock; 19 Jun 14 at 20:39..
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  #73  
Old 19 Jun 14, 19:58
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On a maybe related/maybe not related topic, on September 1, 1952, a tornado of Carswell AFB in Forth Worth destroyed many of the nation's nuclear capable bombers. Carswell AFB had been Fort Worth Army Air Field which is involved in the Roswell narrative. It almost makes one wonder. Link to another thread on the topic.

http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forum...hlight=tornado

There are pictures of the bombers on the first link, but the pictures do not allow themselves to be copied and posted.
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Old 19 Jun 14, 20:45
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At the time this supposedly happened, July 1947, the 509th BG was stationed at Roswell and was the only atomic bomb capable bomber group in the then USAAF (USAF would be formed in September of 1947).

"Odd" that someone would want to stage an intel ruse that would entangle a supposedly secret airbase and secret bomber group? One would think a more innocuous airbase would have been chosen.

http://www.whiteman.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123062208
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Old 20 Jun 14, 10:06
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Quote:
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Do you think the "Roswell Incident" was an example of offensive counterintelligence? Do you think the US spread disinformation on a fantastic sounding story, so that Soviet agents in the country would feel compelled to look into this, even if they would have severe doubts about its truth?


I think this was probably what happened. I've never believed that an intelligence officer at the base with the B-29's (or any Air Force officer) would issue a press release about "crashed flying saucer" like this without authorization.
I think it was part of it but also it was a good way of deflecting news stories away from black book projects that had been seen by the public.
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