France-what went wrong?

[UGLYGUTS]

I wanted to start a thread about the fall of france, from the moment the first shot got fired to capitulation, this isnt a roast of the french, as i reckon we share the blame or responsability.

Could the germans have been halted, was there even a point where that even seemed likely ?.
Or were we just too ill prepared for the new style of war the germans invented.

If we look at numbers and kit before the germans pounced was it an even match on paper, what did the BEF and the french have between them, should it have been enough?

[Conlin]

The French and Brits had the tanks, but they lacked radios, and their tactics were...outmoded. They also lacked anti-tank and anti-air guns, which didn't help at all.

-O'Reilly

P.S. - If anybody feels I have let something out, please, post it in the next post.

[Gooner]

France's allies were ... disappointing

[Full Monty]

We've covered this in exhaustive detail on the 'France Military Planning' thread. Do we need to do it again?

[lcm1]

Originally Posted by Gooner

France's allies were ... disappointing

For the last time Frances 'allies' had little choice but evacuate after THEIR 'allie' dropped them in the POO! I willalso add for the last time I am not denigrating the poor old French 'plods' by saying that only their Government!! Now finish eh?

[johnbryan]

Originally Posted by Full Monty

We've covered this in exhaustive detail on the 'France Military Planning' thread. Do we need to do it again?

I must have missed that bit. Perhaps we could do it all over again right here?~~

[Full Monty]

Originally Posted by lcm1

For the last time Frances 'allies' had little choice but evacuate after THEIR 'allie' dropped them in the POO! I willalso add for the last time I am not denigrating the poor old French 'plods' by saying that only their Government!!

France's allies were so disappointing that the only one to survive 1940 liberated the rest of them.

Now finish eh?

No chance of that. Once that old knob-jockey gets an idea into his head nothing can shift it.

[Full Monty]

Originally Posted by johnbryan

I must have missed that bit. Perhaps we could do it all over again right here?~~

What do you think this is, 'Operation Sealion - Was It Possible?"?

[johnbryan]

Originally Posted by Full Monty

What do you think this is, 'Operation Sealion - Was It Possible?"?

Funny you should mention that!~

[lcm1]

Originally Posted by Full Monty

France's allies were so disappointing that the only one to survive 1940 liberated the rest of them.



No chance of that. Once that old knob-jockey gets an idea into his head nothing can shift it.

Well i tell you what Monty, I for one will not be answering any mail on that subject. (There's more than one way to kill a cat!!)

[Full Monty]

Originally Posted by lcm1

Well i tell you what Monty, I for one will not be answering any mail on that subject. (There's more than one way to kill a cat!!)

Probably wise (although it's 'skin a cat' as far as I'm aware).

[MonsterZero]

Originally Posted by UGLYGUTS

I wanted to start a thread about the fall of france, from the moment the first shot got fired to capitulation, this isnt a roast of the french, as i reckon we share the blame or responsability.

Could the germans have been halted, was there even a point where that even seemed likely ?.
Or were we just too ill prepared for the new style of war the germans invented.

If we look at numbers and kit before the germans pounced was it an even match on paper, what did the BEF and the french have between them, should it have been enough?

The promise of the Maginot Line destroyed the fighting spirit of the French forces and the initiative of the government. The French soldiers became what we call "campers" in online shooters-people who cower in a foxhole shooting opponents in the back but refusing to take the initiative. This mentality started with the impotent old fool Gen. Gamelin and filtered down the ranks to the lowliest private. Individually the French soldiers were poorly paid and living in impoverished conditions. They had little or no faith in the leadership.

In contrast, German soldiers were treated very well indeed, well-fed, well-equipped, earning outstanding money by 1930s standards and receiving generous home leave. Their NCOs were fine men who treated the privates with respect-they were not the kinds of Prussian drill fanatics Hollywood would like us to believe.

The fall of France was a collapse or the French morale more than anything else. As many others have pointed out the German tanks and other weapons were actually weaker than many of their French equivalents. However, the Germans have succeeded in putting together a terrific team of people. It's like in sports really-the better team with the higher morale will win.

[Gooner]

People still seem to be under the impression that somehow France and Germany were equally matched powers. They were not. Bottom line Germany had almost twice the population and twice the industry. The very best France could do alone was to lose more slowly than they did historically. And the advantage of that - a much greater bodycount.

[joea]

*Ahem* as others have said:

http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forum...ad.php?t=35753

[clems]

They weren't equal: Germany engaged 500,000 more men than France in this battle and had a far superior air power. Germany produced six time more steel than france and their tanks had a better mobility.