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  #1  
Old 19 Jul 08, 16:59
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German/Japanese alliance

I was wondering as I was watching "Der Untergang" yesterday...
How was the relationship between Hitler and Emperor Hirohito? Or if you will between the Germans and Japanese? Were there any coordinated attacks planned during WWII or did they handle independent from each other? I doubt that Hitler ever met Hirohito, but did their diplomats ever meet in Germany or in Japan?

I'm curious to know more...who will inform me?



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  #2  
Old 19 Jul 08, 17:33
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Japanese and German staffs and ambassadors did visit each other's countries. The last Japanese Ambassador to the United States was the one to sign the Triparttite Pact in Berlin. There was no joint actions by the German and Japanese military. The Japanese did send submarines to Germany to pick up cargo. And the Japanese allowed the Auxliary Cruisers and U-boats to use Singapore and Japan for Rest and Refit. Naturally the Germans also sent U-boats with supplies for the Japanese to Japan. Not a lot to come out of the alliance. Germany declared war on the United States in the hope that Japan would do the same to the Soviet Union. It didn't work.'
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Old 21 Jul 08, 17:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardS View Post
. Germany declared war on the United States in the hope that Japan would do the same to the Soviet Union. It didn't work.'
The major reason Hitler declared war on the USA wasn't due to the hope that Japan would declare war on the Soviet Union. Hitler already considered that the USA was in a state of 'undeclared' war against Germany, as the US was already supplying Britain and the Soviet Union with war supplies through Lend-Lease, and the US Navy was escorting convoys to Britain.
To Hitler it wasn't a case of 'if' the USA went to war with Germany it was merely a case of 'when'.
So he decided that in declaring war against the USA just after the devastating attack on the US Pacific fleet, he would both gain a valuable ally, and it would enable him to launch an unrestricted submarine campaign against US shipping in the Atlantic, which he hoped would keep the USA occupied until he had enough time to finally defeat the Soviet Union.
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Old 21 Jul 08, 19:44
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Of course Hitler wanted Japan to join his attack on the USSR, but since Japan had decided by October that it would not attack the Soviet Union until, at the very earliest, spring 1942 (and even then only if success looked easy), and since its actions in early December 1941 clearly pointed Japan's sword towards the south (Indochina, et al.) rather than north, it would have been a very difficult case for Hitler's ambassador to make.
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Old 21 Jul 08, 20:19
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I wonder if Zhukov's rough treatment of the Japanese at Khalkingol in 1939 didn't have more to do with their decision not to go to war with the USSR after Pearl Harbor. It must have been quite a rude awakening to the Japanese to watch a highly mechanized force of Soviet Armor and troops rip through the Japanese positions like a hot knife through butter.
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Old 22 Jul 08, 04:02
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Since early 30's, Japenese envisionned enventual consequence of an expansion.

Japenese Army favored an expansion in continental Asia, Navy a strike to seize strategic ressources in south east. Both recognized that other's strategy had its merit but each supported its own. By 1936, the case was solved by a compromise with "Fundamentals principles of national politic" : Army would continue its expansion in China and consolidate Japan gains there, Navy would then strike south in order to give Japan the needed raw ressource. The compromise stated that any friction with USSR was to be avoided as much as possible.

Briefly, the plan begun by Sino-Japenese war of 1937. This war proved to not be as easy than Army believed. It also triggered the US reaction that later lead to embargo itslef calling for Japan to implement the Navy part with Pearl harbor has end result.

Nomonhan had no effect on Japan strategy but to reinforce the "South seas" option that had already been chosen. Contrary to common belief it not had been a piece of cake for Soviets. Japenese then demonstrated the ability to take punishing losses without unit disintegration that Allies would later confront with in Pacific and Burma.

"The unsupported Soviet tanks and armored cars rolled forward and did blunt the Japanese offensive. The cost, however, to both sides was high. Japanese troops destroyed at least 120 Soviet tanks or armored cars with Molotov cocktails, 37-mm antitank guns, and antitank mines..."

http://www-cgsc.army.mil/carl/resour...rea2/drea2.asp
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Old 22 Jul 08, 05:47
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Essentially, Germany and Japan fought seperate wars, and in seperate theatres.

In the one realm where they might have coordinated their military actions, against the Soviet Union, there was mutually divergent strategic outlooks. The Japanese, simply put, were reluctant to take on the Soviet Union, and in any case had greater strategic concerns in the south. Like Germany, Japan was looking for natural resources, and was looking at the rich oil fields of Borneo and the rubber plantations and mines of Malaya. Germany, on the other hand, was looking at the Soviet Union - particularly Ukraine's and Georgia's - mineral wealth.
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Old 23 Jul 08, 16:20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redcoat View Post
The major reason Hitler declared war on the USA wasn't due to the hope that Japan would declare war on the Soviet Union. Hitler already considered that the USA was in a state of 'undeclared' war against Germany, as the US was already supplying Britain and the Soviet Union with war supplies through Lend-Lease, and the US Navy was escorting convoys to Britain.
To Hitler it wasn't a case of 'if' the USA went to war with Germany it was merely a case of 'when'.
So he decided that in declaring war against the USA just after the devastating attack on the US Pacific fleet, he would both gain a valuable ally, and it would enable him to launch an unrestricted submarine campaign against US shipping in the Atlantic, which he hoped would keep the USA occupied until he had enough time to finally defeat the Soviet Union.
True, but I was doing the quick and dirty history. I can't and won't deny what you said is very important too.
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