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Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Historical Events & Eras > World War II > Armor in World War II > German and Axis Armor

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German and Axis Armor Discuss German and Axis armored fighting vehicles in World War II. This is also the forum for Achtung Panzer.

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  #1  
Old 21 Feb 08, 18:45
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Exclamation PzKpfw. V Panther

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqJCF...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtyZCNpU4E0&NR=1
Players of the "Medal of Honor" games will recognize this one's music:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgqoB...eature=related
My favorite German tank of WW2...




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Last edited by Boonierat; 22 Feb 08 at 03:06..
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  #2  
Old 21 Feb 08, 20:02
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but is "die legende" German for "the legend"?
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  #3  
Old 21 Feb 08, 20:36
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Originally Posted by cougar1 View Post
Correct me if I'm wrong, but is "die legende" German for "the legend"?
Correctomundo!!!
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  #4  
Old 22 Feb 08, 02:59
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Yes, the Panther is my favourite WW2 German tank as well.
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Old 22 Feb 08, 17:30
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Thumbs up PzKw V Aufs G

Models A and D of the PzKw V had defects which were corrected in the G model. Originally, the design was greatly influenced by the Russian T-34 (inclined frontal armor) and the 7.5cm KwK42 was as good a tank gun as almost any other. Much faster than the Tiger, the PzKw V was available in much greater numbers.
I wonder how the war would have changed it this tank had been available in large numbers on June 22, 1941. Maybe not at all, maybe a great deal.
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Old 22 Feb 08, 21:56
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I wonder how the war would have changed it this tank had been available in large numbers on June 22, 1941.

Nobody even thought of the Panther until they met the T-34, so no chance of that.

Mark IIIs with 50mm L-60s from the outset would have made all the difference.

Building more self-propelled 105mm K18s would have made a huge differnece, but they only made 2 of those.

Having reasonable human beings in charge of Germany, instead of Nazis, would have been descisive... but that's just my opinion.
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Old 22 Feb 08, 22:09
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[B]Having reasonable human beings in charge of Germany, instead of Nazis, would have been descisive... but that's just my opinion.


Letting the military make the military decisions would be a good starting point as well
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Old 22 Feb 08, 23:14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwerepunkt View Post
"Models A and D of the PzKw V had defects which were corrected in the G model."
Most of the 'defects' as such were progressively dealt with and had little or nothing to do with the Ausfuhrung. The problem that proved most difficult to address, failure of transmission/final drive units, was never properly resolved at any time in the Panther's service life.
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Old 22 Feb 08, 23:18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exorcist View Post
[B] "Mark IIIs with 50mm L-60s from the outset would have made all the difference."
They certainly would have helped.


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"Having reasonable human beings in charge of Germany, instead of Nazis, would have been descisive... but that's just my opinion."
I agree, it would have been very decisive indeed. No war!
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Old 23 Feb 08, 12:08
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Thumbs up Reasonable thinking....

...not possible as long as Adolf Hitler was Supreme Commander of the OKW.
Granted, the Panther was not even thought of before they met the T-34. Germany felt like the tanks she started with would suffice for victory. Earlier research and development of improved armor and firepower might have changed matters.
I think only the Mark IV with the 7.5cm/48 would have been of much use against T-34. And then there was KV-1 to deal with. Despite the defects, my favorite tank of WW2 is the Panther.
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Old 23 Feb 08, 15:38
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Panzerkampfwagen V Panther Ausf. G Drawing

Check out the four-view drawing "Panzerkampfwagen V Panther Ausf. G" in cougar1's original post. The drawing shows a frontal opening - a vision flap, on the glacis plate (like that of a Ausf. A & D). I don't believe the G ever had this...?
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Old 23 Feb 08, 16:38
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Check out the four-view drawing "Panzerkampfwagen V Panther Ausf. G" in cougar1's original post. The drawing shows a frontal opening - a vision flap, on the glacis plate (like that of a Ausf. A & D). I don't believe the G ever had this...?
You are correct. The lack of the flap in the glacis plate was one of the G's most distinctive features.
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Old 23 Feb 08, 21:19
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Poll:
Which do you think this tank was named after? Depending on the area, all three were known as "panthers."
*Felis Concolor (Puma, Cougar, etc.)
*Panthera Pardus (Leopard)
*Panthera Onca (Jaguar)
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Old 23 Feb 08, 22:01
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwerepunkt View Post
"I think only the Mark IV with the 7.5cm/48 would have been of much use against T-34. And then there was KV-1 to deal with."
While not as potent as the long 75s, the 5cm KwK39 L/60 was a considerable improvement over the L/42. Using standard PzGr ammo, it could penetrate about 14mm more armour at most ranges. This was enough to make a worthwhile difference against T-34 in many situations.

Of course, the 7.5cm KwK40 L/43 proved very adequate against T-34 at most ranges and under most conditions, the L/48 even better, so these guns (and their StuK40 equivalents used in the long-gunned StuG III) were the real beginning of a change of gun/armour balance against the Soviet machine.
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Old 23 Feb 08, 22:45
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the 2nd to last pic has a front vision flap and no hull mg, thats new to me. i thought all models had a hull mg? although there is a little block where the mg would be...
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