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RKKA (The Russian Army) in World War II Discuss the Russian armed forces in World War II. Hosted by our resident Russian expert, AMVAS. Please visit his RKKA in WW2 Website.

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  #16  
Old 18 Sep 07, 15:24
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Upside down U

Hi:

I have several tables for transliteration, but I can not find a Cyrillic letter that looks like an upside down U with the top flat, instead of curved.

Help?

Regards,

John
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  #17  
Old 18 Sep 07, 22:30
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Originally Posted by John Calvin View Post
Hi:

I have several tables for transliteration, but I can not find a Cyrillic letter that looks like an upside down U with the top flat, instead of curved.

Help?

Regards,

John

"" - analogue of Latin "p"
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  #18  
Old 18 Sep 07, 23:26
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Cyrillic

Andrey:

I am confused. My table has a character that looks like II with a diagnal line and the latin is i. The character II without the diagnal line is supposed to be p.

John
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  #19  
Old 19 Sep 07, 00:44
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Originally Posted by John Calvin View Post
Andrey:

I am confused. My table has a character that looks like II with a diagnal line and the latin is i. The character II without the diagnal line is supposed to be p.

John
"П", "п" - analogue of Latin "p".

"И", "u" - analogue of Latin "i".

"Й" - hmmm... usually it is "i" or "y"

"Н" - analogue of Latin "n"

Last edited by Andrey; 19 Sep 07 at 00:48..
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  #20  
Old 19 Sep 07, 10:41
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Cyrillic Alphabet

Andrey:

Now I get it, I think. Verifying that I have correctly transliterated the names of locations on Russian maps is very difficult. Comparing my results with German maps is problematic as they use their own German words, or they use nicknames, or the location is not noted at all, or the city or town is in the wrong place.

Thanks for the help,

John
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  #21  
Old 20 Sep 07, 06:45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Calvin View Post
Andrey:

Now I get it, I think. Verifying that I have correctly transliterated the names of locations on Russian maps is very difficult. Comparing my results with German maps is problematic as they use their own German words, or they use nicknames, or the location is not noted at all, or the city or town is in the wrong place.

Thanks for the help,

John
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APPENDIX I RUSSIAN ALPHABET TRANSLITERATION ACCORDING TO U. S. BOARD OF GEOGRAPHIC NAMES
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  #22  
Old 07 Oct 07, 07:52
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Soviet supply units translations

Hi Alex,

I have a little problem with the Perechen lists due to many words I don't know. For supply units what exactly are the:
Field Army Depots - Prodovolystvennie
Field Army Depots - Obozno-Vechevoy

Among others but now these if you can help me.

Thanks
Mat
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  #23  
Old 07 Oct 07, 09:16
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Hi, Mat

Quote:
Originally Posted by matasso View Post
Hi Alex,

I have a little problem with the Perechen lists due to many words I don't know. For supply units what exactly are the:
Field Army Depots - Prodovolystvennie
Field Army Depots - Obozno-Vechevoy

Among others but now these if you can help me.

Thanks
Mat
Field Army Depots - Prodovolystvennie
- Food depots

Field Army Depots - Obozno-Vechevoy
Hmm... It's more hard to explain.
Direct translation would be Carts-store.
I can guess they were depots of goods for horses

Regards
Alex
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  #24  
Old 07 Oct 07, 11:56
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Field Army Depots - Obozno-Vechevoy
Mat,

You can see there are two words:
'Obozno' means supply for horse-drawn carts
'Veschevoy' means clothes, footwear and personal non-combat equipment (belts, knapsacks an so on)

Sometimes those types were mentioned together, sometimes were divided in "Veschevoe" supply and "Obozno-hozyaistvennoe" supply.
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  #25  
Old 07 Oct 07, 23:18
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Mat,

You can see there are two words:
'Obozno' means supply for horse-drawn carts
'Veschevoy' means clothes, footwear and personal non-combat equipment (belts, knapsacks an so on)

Sometimes those types were mentioned together, sometimes were divided in "Veschevoe" supply and "Obozno-hozyaistvennoe" supply.
You mix "oboznyi" and "guzhevoi".

'Guzhevoi' means supply for horse-drawn carts.

"Oboznyi" is an archaic word from ancient time when rear services were called "obozy". So in some military terms it was used as "rears services".

So "Obozno" can mean rear services supply depot.
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  #26  
Old 08 Oct 07, 02:54
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Originally Posted by Andrey View Post
You mix "oboznyi" and "guzhevoi".

'Guzhevoi' means supply for horse-drawn carts.

"Oboznyi" is an archaic word from ancient time when rear services were called "obozy". So in some military terms it was used as "rears services".

So "Obozno" can mean rear services supply depot.
Andrey,

Perhaps you are right for some time periods or some units or arms. IIRC in WWII rear services usually included:
1) Subsistence Supply (Prodovolstvennoe Snabzhenie) or Subsistence and Forage Supply (Prodovolstvenno-Furazhnoe Snabzhenie)
2) Сlothing and other non-combat equipment Supply (Veschevoe Snabzhenie)
3) "Obozno-hozyaistvennoe Snabzhenie"
Sometimes second and third combined in "Obozno-Veschevoe Snabzhenie". I suppose it can be checked easily with NKO organizational orders for instance. I have never heard about 'Guzhevoi' Supply. But horse-drawn cart or sleigh were used widely and they needed lots of special supply. Personally for me supply for personnel is "Veschevoe Snabzhenie", carts and other equipment for horse-drawn transport is "Oboznoe Hozyastvo" so supply for it is "Obozno-hozyaistvennoe Snabzhenie".

In any case it seems pretty difficult to find exact translation for that

P.S. In WWII RKKA had Obozno-Veschevoe Upravlenie, now it is named Veschevoe Upravlenie - because of russian army does not have horse-drawn transport now but they have rear service of course I suppose.
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  #27  
Old 08 Oct 07, 03:23
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Guzhevoi transport - the oficial name of horse-drawn carts
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  #28  
Old 10 Oct 07, 11:00
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supply translations

Many thanks all for the help.


As for Obozno-Vechevoy is seems difficult because the units always appear as one in the Perechen Lists. Could it be simply horse transported clothing supply depots?

I have some other help to ask

First what is torgovo-zagotovntelynaya?

and as I know imushetva is ammunition. Can it also mean equipment or something similar. Because if its logical for chemical ammo depots its less for engineer ammo or trophy ammo depots

Thanks
Mat
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  #29  
Old 10 Oct 07, 12:08
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Many thanks all for the help.


As for Obozno-Vechevoy is seems difficult because the units always appear as one in the Perechen Lists. Could it be simply horse transported clothing supply depots?

I have some other help to ask

First what is torgovo-zagotovntelynaya?

and as I know imushetva is ammunition. Can it also mean equipment or something similar. Because if its logical for chemical ammo depots its less for engineer ammo or trophy ammo depots

Thanks
Mat
imushchestvo ~ impedimenta. It can mean absoltely different sort of equipment. It's very wide term and includes almost all goods needed for army (inlcuding ammunition too)

boyepripasy = ammunition

torgovo-zagotovitel'naya ~ commercial purchsing

Regards
Alex
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  #30  
Old 10 Oct 07, 12:37
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Smile supply translations

Many thanks Alex,

So Imushetvo is generic, ok so it explains a lot; I suppose then torgovo/torgovaya are commercial so it would explain the romanian targ = market, negociation... hehehe, even a latin language can have influences

Mat
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