HistoryNet.com RSS
ArmchairGeneral.com RSS

HistoryNet.com Articles
America's Civil War
American History
Aviation History
Civil War Times
MHQ
Military History
Vietnam
Wild West
World War II

ACG Online
ACG Magazine
Stuff We Like
War College
History News
Tactics 101
Carlo D'Este
Books

ACG Gaming
Boardgames
PC Game Reviews

ACG Network
Contact Us
Our Newsletter
Meet Our Staff
Advertise With Us

Sites We Support
HistoryNet.com
StreamHistory.com
Once A Marine
The Art of Battle
Game Squad
Mil. History Podcast
Russian Army - WW2
Achtung Panzer!
Mil History Online

Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Historical Events & Eras > Warfare Through the Ages > Age of Pike and Shot

Notices and Announcements

Age of Pike and Shot 30 Years War, War of Spanish Succession, English Civil War, etc.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 01 Feb 06, 08:31
Janos's Avatar
Janos Janos is offline
General of the Forums
Hungary
Distinguished Service Award ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Real Name: János ispán Vezérőrnagy
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Fredericksburg, Virginia (CSA)
Posts: 14,853
Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700]
Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700]
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatih
Both my father's and mother's side were living in Caucasus Mountains. They were Christian farmers.The Mongols had probably just left their land.

Regards
Fatih
When did the Mongols leave that area? I always thought they just blended in, as they did further east and north.
__________________
Barcsi János ispán vezérőrnagy
Time Magazine's Person of the Year for 2003 & 2006


"Never pet a burning dog."

RECOMMENDED WEBSITES:
http://www.mormon.org
http://www.sca.org
http://www.scv.org/
http://www.scouting.org/
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01 Feb 06, 14:44
fatih's Avatar
fatih fatih is offline
First Sergeant
Turkey
ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Real Name: Fatih
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Istanbul/Turkey
Posts: 245
fatih is on the path to success [1-99] fatih is on the path to success [1-99] fatih is on the path to success [1-99] fatih is on the path to success [1-99] fatih is on the path to success [1-99] fatih is on the path to success [1-99]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Janos
When did the Mongols leave that area? I always thought they just blended in, as they did further east and north.
They probably left the Caucasus area in mid 15th century. I don't know exact time. Circassians lands were not invaded by Ottomans by then and they were living as Christian farmers. After they were converted to Muslim, they were used as the first line of defence against the threatening armies of east.

Regards
Fatih
__________________
"A nation which makes the final sacrifice for life and freedom does not get beaten." - Mustafa Kemal ATATURK
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01 Feb 06, 14:46
Janos's Avatar
Janos Janos is offline
General of the Forums
Hungary
Distinguished Service Award ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Real Name: János ispán Vezérőrnagy
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Fredericksburg, Virginia (CSA)
Posts: 14,853
Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700]
Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700] Janos is a glorious beacon of light [700]
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatih
They probably left the Caucasus area in mid 15th century. I don't know exact time. Circassians lands were not invaded by Ottomans by then and they were living as Christian farmers. After they were converted to Muslim, they were used as the first line of defence against the threatening armies of east.

Regards
Fatih
Thanks for the info!
__________________
Barcsi János ispán vezérőrnagy
Time Magazine's Person of the Year for 2003 & 2006


"Never pet a burning dog."

RECOMMENDED WEBSITES:
http://www.mormon.org
http://www.sca.org
http://www.scv.org/
http://www.scouting.org/
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01 Feb 06, 20:18
Admiral's Avatar
Admiral Admiral is offline
ACG Forums - Guardiano di Roma
Pirate
Distinguished Service Award ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon March Offensive 
Summer Campaign 100 Greatest Generals, 2008 Most Decisive Battle Campaign, 2008 Greatest Westerns Campaign 
Greatest Spy Movies Campaign Greatest Blunders Campaign Best Pin-Up Of World War II Model Forum Group Build (Multiple) 
SPQR Campaign 
 
Real Name: Wes
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Permian Basin
Posts: 20,345
Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+]
Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+]
That's very interesting, Fatih. Thanx! That's why I love it here. The global connect is much more to my liking than so many others.

When did most of the conversion occur?

__________________
On the Plains of Hesitation lie the blackened bones of countless millions who, at the dawn of victory, sat down to rest-and resting... died. Adlai E. Stevenson

ACG History Today

BoRG
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 02 Feb 06, 12:38
fatih's Avatar
fatih fatih is offline
First Sergeant
Turkey
ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Real Name: Fatih
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Istanbul/Turkey
Posts: 245
fatih is on the path to success [1-99] fatih is on the path to success [1-99] fatih is on the path to success [1-99] fatih is on the path to success [1-99] fatih is on the path to success [1-99] fatih is on the path to success [1-99]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Admiral
That's very interesting, Fatih. Thanx! That's why I love it here. The global connect is much more to my liking than so many others.

When did most of the conversion occur?

You are welcome friends. I really like to learn new things from you and share what I know with you.

Admiral, Caucasia was invaded by Ottomans in 1579. Most of the Caucasian population including the Circassians were converted to muslim till the end of the century. But most conversion of Christians to Islam occured after the conquest of Balkans.

Regards
Fatih
__________________
"A nation which makes the final sacrifice for life and freedom does not get beaten." - Mustafa Kemal ATATURK
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links

  #21  
Old 17 Jul 06, 21:54
johnbryan's Avatar
johnbryan johnbryan is offline
General of the Forums
United_States
ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon Best Pin-Up Of World War II 
 
Real Name: John
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Michigan
Posts: 25,893
johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+]
johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+] johnbryan has achieved enlightenment [1200+]
A third of my family was from Poland. They were landowners who may or may not have been noblemen. Another third was from Hungary probably fighting the Muslims. A sixth is of questionable background and the rest was Cherokee Indian stock.
__________________
"Profanity is but a linguistic crutch for illiterate motherbleepers"
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 19 Jul 06, 15:07
Roadblock's Avatar
Roadblock Roadblock is offline
Gunnery Sergeant
United_States
ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Washington, D.C.
Posts: 219
Roadblock is on the path to success [1-99] Roadblock is on the path to success [1-99] Roadblock is on the path to success [1-99]
Dirt Farmers in Germany, Dirt Farmers in Ulster, and then Dirt farmers in America. Fought some wars along the way.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 19 Jul 06, 15:30
zinkyusa's Avatar
zinkyusa zinkyusa is offline
Second Lieutenant
United_States
 
Real Name: Ed
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 411
zinkyusa is on the path to success [1-99] zinkyusa is on the path to success [1-99] zinkyusa is on the path to success [1-99] zinkyusa is on the path to success [1-99]
My mother's ancestors were French Hugenots forced to flee the country (they were actually on the Mayflower). There several French families aboard apparently. My dear old Dad's great, great grandfather was a horse thief in Scotland supposeadly given the option of being hung, or heading for the new world.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 19 Jul 06, 15:52
Deathrider6's Avatar
Deathrider6 Deathrider6 is offline
First Lieutenant
United_States
ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Real Name: Rusty Shackleford
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Panama City
Posts: 634
Deathrider6 is on the path to success [1-99] Deathrider6 is on the path to success [1-99] Deathrider6 is on the path to success [1-99] Deathrider6 is on the path to success [1-99] Deathrider6 is on the path to success [1-99] Deathrider6 is on the path to success [1-99] Deathrider6 is on the path to success [1-99]
My mother's side the Heekin's came from Donegal County in Ireland. One of my ancestor's was a local warlord/brigand who was executed by the English.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 29 Jul 06, 05:39
RapierFighter's Avatar
RapierFighter RapierFighter is offline
Lieutenant General
United_States
ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon Summer Campaign 
 
Real Name: Michael Beecher
Join Date: May 2006
Location: San Diego, California
Posts: 3,241
RapierFighter is a jewel in the rough [500]
RapierFighter is a jewel in the rough [500] RapierFighter is a jewel in the rough [500] RapierFighter is a jewel in the rough [500] RapierFighter is a jewel in the rough [500] RapierFighter is a jewel in the rough [500] RapierFighter is a jewel in the rough [500] RapierFighter is a jewel in the rough [500] RapierFighter is a jewel in the rough [500] RapierFighter is a jewel in the rough [500]
Quote:
Originally Posted by R.N. Armstrong
The Armstrongs were border reivers between England and Scotland. The often raided with the Elliots. They invented the insurance racket centuries before Al Capone. Mail was the rent one paid on their property. Blackmail was what you paid the Armstrong's not to burn down your house and steal your cattle. The Armstrongs, along with other great border families, were some of the best light cavalry in western Europe, and they hired out to different armies.
WHat we know of my father's direct ancestor is interesting, and quite in line with your post.

My ancestor was named Michael McBaechum (correct spelling). He was a particularly notorious reiver who tore a path of hell through the Scottish and English Middle March. He was sentenced by a tribunal of English and Scots wardens in 1603 to hanging for a laundry list of messed up stuff.

What we know about him is sketchy from there. He apparently hid in plain sight in England for a while, where he anglicized his name to Beecher. I guess he felt the heat on, because his next known locale was Jamestown, Virginia in 1607, where he acted as one of Captain John Smith's officers. We do know he was elected to the House of Burgesses in the 1620s, and we think he died in the 1630s, but when he was born and how old he was when he died we have no idea. But we know that he had four children, three of whom lived to adulthood. William, Charles, and Sarah. These names have come up repeatedly in my family line in the 400 years since, as both my name, my father's name, and my father's aunt's name indicate.

My mother is descended directly from Don Manuel Guadalupe Santiago de Armijo. He was a minor Spanish noble from Castille who accompanied Onate on his expeditions into the American Southwest in the latter half of the 16th century. He was apparently a dedicated and loyal officer, and was personally very close to Onate. He was awarded tracks of land in what is now New Mexico, and his descendants have continued to live here in the more than four centuries since. One of his ancestors was a colonial governor of New Mexico, who served as an officer under Santa Ana during the war to overthrow Spanish rule, and twenty years later, when New Mexico became part of the US, he served as a territorial senator. He made the transition of Spaniard to Mexican to American quite well, one should imagine.

Pike and shotte, yes, that's what I know about my ancestors back then.

By the way, it's sketchy, but what few records we have of Michael McBaechum was that he was a stong ally of the Elliots, and therefore, possibly the Armstrongs.

Thought you might find that interesting.
__________________
"Yellowstain!"
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 31 Jul 06, 08:07
R.N. Armstrong's Avatar
R.N. Armstrong R.N. Armstrong is offline
ACG Author
United_States
Distinguished Service Award ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Plainview
Posts: 8,309
R.N. Armstrong has earned the respect of all [900] R.N. Armstrong has earned the respect of all [900]
R.N. Armstrong has earned the respect of all [900] R.N. Armstrong has earned the respect of all [900] R.N. Armstrong has earned the respect of all [900] R.N. Armstrong has earned the respect of all [900] R.N. Armstrong has earned the respect of all [900] R.N. Armstrong has earned the respect of all [900]
Quote:
Originally Posted by RapierFighter
WHat we know of my father's direct ancestor is interesting, and quite in line with your post.

My ancestor was named Michael McBaechum (correct spelling). He was a particularly notorious reiver who tore a path of hell through the Scottish and English Middle March. He was sentenced by a tribunal of English and Scots wardens in 1603 to hanging for a laundry list of messed up stuff.

What we know about him is sketchy from there. He apparently hid in plain sight in England for a while, where he anglicized his name to Beecher. I guess he felt the heat on, because his next known locale was Jamestown, Virginia in 1607, where he acted as one of Captain John Smith's officers. We do know he was elected to the House of Burgesses in the 1620s, and we think he died in the 1630s, but when he was born and how old he was when he died we have no idea. But we know that he had four children, three of whom lived to adulthood. William, Charles, and Sarah. These names have come up repeatedly in my family line in the 400 years since, as both my name, my father's name, and my father's aunt's name indicate.

My mother is descended directly from Don Manuel Guadalupe Santiago de Armijo. He was a minor Spanish noble from Castille who accompanied Onate on his expeditions into the American Southwest in the latter half of the 16th century. He was apparently a dedicated and loyal officer, and was personally very close to Onate. He was awarded tracks of land in what is now New Mexico, and his descendants have continued to live here in the more than four centuries since. One of his ancestors was a colonial governor of New Mexico, who served as an officer under Santa Ana during the war to overthrow Spanish rule, and twenty years later, when New Mexico became part of the US, he served as a territorial senator. He made the transition of Spaniard to Mexican to American quite well, one should imagine.

Pike and shotte, yes, that's what I know about my ancestors back then.

By the way, it's sketchy, but what few records we have of Michael McBaechum was that he was a stong ally of the Elliots, and therefore, possibly the Armstrongs.

Thought you might find that interesting.
That's great. Your family rode with a rough crowd. Along the way, the English King hung a Johnny Armstrong after inviting him to a parley.
__________________
Leadership is the ability to rise above conventional wisdom.

Last edited by R.N. Armstrong; 31 Jul 06 at 08:10..
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 30 May 07, 05:04
pcemilkman's Avatar
pcemilkman pcemilkman is offline
Private
United_States
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Olympia, Washington
Posts: 12
pcemilkman is on the path to success [1-99]
I have a couple of interesting ancestor from this time period.

Pieter Winne, who was born in Ghent, Flanders abt 1604, immigrated in the 1650's to Rensselaerswyck, New Amsterdam. He set up shop in as a sawmill operator. He is the common ancestor of the Winne/Winner family in America.


Joris Janszen Rapelje, born in Rochelle France, immegrated in 1623 on the ship Unity and landed near Fort Orange, New Amsterdam. He was one of the first europeans in the New York area to purchase land from the Native Indians. On 16 June 1637 he purchased and area called Rinnegakonck, on Long Island, from a couple of Indians named Kakapeyno and Pewichaas. Apperantly, now the land is near the presant Brooklyn Naval Yard. Later in life he was a bar keep. Joris is the common ancestor of the Rapelje's in America.

John Warren, born in Nayland, Sufolk, England about 1585. He immigrated to Salem Colony in 1630 an the ship Arabella. It was a ship in the fleet of Sir Richard Salton Stall. Not a very interesting man on his own. What does make him interesting is the fact that he is desceded from William de Warenne (who fought at the Battle of Hastings), First Earl of Surrey, who married Gundred, Daughter of Matilda of Flanders and William the Conqueror. Of course those two are a little early for this particulay forum.

Last edited by pcemilkman; 30 May 07 at 05:07..
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 02 Jun 07, 09:19
AlexGeorge's Avatar
AlexGeorge AlexGeorge is offline
Private
Greece
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Athens
Posts: 19
AlexGeorge is on the path to success [1-99]
In my Greek side, my ancestors in the Age of Pike and Shot where what we call (Robbers and Men-At-Arms) Κλέφτες και Αρματολοί , which meant that they stole goods and arms from the Ottoman Turks who had enslaved the Greek population in that time and gave it to the Monasteries where the Turks could not interfeare so that they could establish local revolutions. About my English-Hungarian side I don't know much, I only know that my oldest ancestor was Thomas Robinson born in about 1615, can you help me learn more about him?
__________________
Joy can not be found in the material world, but only in ourselves.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 02 Jun 07, 10:11
Admiral's Avatar
Admiral Admiral is offline
ACG Forums - Guardiano di Roma
Pirate
Distinguished Service Award ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon March Offensive 
Summer Campaign 100 Greatest Generals, 2008 Most Decisive Battle Campaign, 2008 Greatest Westerns Campaign 
Greatest Spy Movies Campaign Greatest Blunders Campaign Best Pin-Up Of World War II Model Forum Group Build (Multiple) 
SPQR Campaign 
 
Real Name: Wes
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Permian Basin
Posts: 20,345
Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+]
Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Admiral has achieved enlightenment [1200+]
Could there be any connection to this Thomas Robinson, AG?

__________________
On the Plains of Hesitation lie the blackened bones of countless millions who, at the dawn of victory, sat down to rest-and resting... died. Adlai E. Stevenson

ACG History Today

BoRG
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 02 Jun 07, 19:56
kentek's Avatar
kentek kentek is offline
General
United_States
ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon March Offensive Summer Campaign 
100 Greatest Generals, 2008 Most Decisive Battle Campaign, 2008 Greatest Westerns Campaign Greatest Spy Movies Campaign 
 
Real Name: Ken Strunk
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Spokane Valley, WA
Posts: 4,199
kentek is a jewel in the rough [500]
kentek is a jewel in the rough [500] kentek is a jewel in the rough [500] kentek is a jewel in the rough [500] kentek is a jewel in the rough [500] kentek is a jewel in the rough [500] kentek is a jewel in the rough [500] kentek is a jewel in the rough [500] kentek is a jewel in the rough [500]
On my father's side:
Welsh coal miners and farmers (with a little border property relocation on the side)
+
A German minor nobleman who 'earned' his title as a Rhine River pirate
+
Cherokee farmers in North Carolina

On my mother's side:
South Peigan (Blackfoot) nomadic hunters from Montana
+
English farmers
+
Your guess is a good as mine
__________________
All questions are valid, all answers are tentative.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links

Reply

Please bookmark this thread if you enjoyed it!


Thread Tools
Display Modes



Forum Jump

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 16:57.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.