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Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Current Events > North America

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North America Important Events in Canada and the United States. .

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  #31  
Old 02 Oct 17, 19:04
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armor11 View Post
No automatic weapons.

There are practically no legal automatic weapons in the US. And those few that are are excruciatingly highly regulated, not to mention old as sin since none of them were made after 1986. Given some time, these will break down and there will be none.

Limit clips/magazines to 8 rounds.

How did you pick this one? I'd like to see your logic, or if this is an arbitrary number you came up with.

Fingerprint/Background check before *any* firearm purchase.

This suspect would have passed ANY AND ALL background checks, so this is irrelevant. There are already background checks in place for ALL firearm purchases. Had this suspect tried to legally purchase an actual automatic firearm, he would have had to comply with the very extensive Class III licensing process.

No concealed carry.

I'm fine with open carrying everywhere. I only conceal carry for the fragile dispositions of liberals anyway. Open carry is far more comfortable.

Massive PR campaign by NRA to discourage the use of assault weapons of any kind, but ESPECIALLY for home defense.

What is an 'assault weapon'? Any weapon used in an assault would be an assault weapon. You really need to be very specific here.

NRA encourages people to use lever action rifles for home defense.


So you're advocating a ban on any weapon not operated manually?


Massive PR campaign by the POTUS for people to turn in their assault weapons voluntarily.


Yeah....I'll be right in line for that. I'll also be right in line to let the government provide me with all of my defense needs. Hell I'm part of the 'government defense matrix' and I know how damnably useless it is. If you're depending on the police to save you, then you're a moron.....let them do their job once they arrive, but between the phone call and their arrival, it's all on you.


Massive PR campaign by NRA for people to turn in all but one of their assault weapons.

Damn. Gonna have to chop off three limbs. Should I keep a foot, or a hand?

No silencers.


Fine. They don't exist anyway. Suppressors do. And mass shooters haven't given a hoot in hell about using them. Suppressors are a safe way of protecting one's hearing, so you'd like an increase in the hearing impaired?


Massive PR campaign by to discourage use of any caliber bullet > .45

Any bullet greater than .50 that is not a shotgun slug is already illegal. And since most shootings period are done with bullets between .22 and .380 in diameter, you would save absolutely no one with such a regulation. Large caliber rounds are used for personal defense against dangerous game.

If you can't smoke there, you can't carry a gun there.

So, arbitrary regulation based on no reason at all? Can we also ban cars anywhere that alcohol is consumed, at least there is a certain logic in that?

The list goes on...
I'm sure.

I've oft said, and will continue to say, if you can make all firearms disappear within North America, I'm absolutely cool with it. I'm a big, trained, fighter. I also know and understand combat with various edged weapons. In a world with firearms I'm in the top 5 percent so long as I have advance warning and time to prepare. In a world without firearms I remain in the top 5 percent at all times. Firearms are what allow the incapable and incompetent to protect themselves against people like me.
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  #32  
Old 02 Oct 17, 19:09
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arthwys View Post
Background/Criminal record check, Psyche eval
No automatic weapons.

Seems simple doesn't it?

And yet...

We already have background checks and
Felons are not permitted to own weapons.

If a person is mentally ill, they are prohibited from purchasing weapons.
Having to prove you are not mentally ill to purchase a weapon means that we no longer have the presumption of innocence, but rather must prove we are not guilty of mental illness in order to exercise a right recognized by the constitution.

Making the exercise of a constitutional right dependent on a psyche evaluation sounds very Soviet in practice.
If we make the 2nd amendment dependent on a psyche eval, we can do the same with Speech or the exercise of abortion rights. I doubt even the anti-gun crowd would approve of that.
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  #33  
Old 02 Oct 17, 19:15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armor11 View Post
The list goes on...
Progressive call for gun control will do nothing but disarm the law abiding. Those who's minds have been poisoned by the Devil will use whatever means they can find to commit mass murder, be it a pressure cooker filled with fireworks, a truck loaded with fertilizer of the right type, cutting a gas line in a building, slashing people in a mall or on a commuter train with a big knife, firebombing a popular night club full of people, releasing poisonous gas in a subway, sending Anthrax tainted letters in the mail, smashing their car into a crowd of people, using a hijacked commercial aircraft to smash into tall buildings, contaminating a municipal water supply with cow feces, placing poison in Tylenol capsules, blowing up an elementary school full of kids, whatever is handy at the time they become possess to do the Devil's bidding. One can find numerous links to every one of the methods above that have killed in the past.

How do you plan on banning everything that could possibly be used to kill including the use of one's fist and hands?
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  #34  
Old 02 Oct 17, 19:16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bwaha View Post
That's belted or drum ammo. listen to how long the bursts are...
Actually consistent with 30 round bursts. Remember, a 5-7 round burst from an actual MG is regulated in the military by the ditty "Die mother die". As soon as I heard the first video last night from my section partner, I said "you're looking at an AK or a 308 AR doing 30 round mag dumps".
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  #35  
Old 02 Oct 17, 19:17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cambronnne View Post
We already have background checks and
Felons are not permitted to own weapons.

If a person is mentally ill, they are prohibited from purchasing weapons.
Having to prove you are not mentally ill to purchase a weapon means that we no longer have the presumption of innocence, but rather must prove we are not guilty of mental illness in order to exercise a right recognized by the constitution.

Making the exercise of a constitutional right dependent on a psyche evaluation sounds very Soviet in practice.
If we make the 2nd amendment dependent on a psyche eval, we can do the same with Speech or the exercise of abortion rights. I doubt even the anti-gun crowd would approve of that.
Well, the NRA video contradicts much of what you say about the background checks.
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  #36  
Old 02 Oct 17, 19:22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pamak View Post
Ironically, your response shows the biggest problem of stigmatizing "mental illness" in general. My concern is exactly not to stigmatize people and take away their constitutional rights just because they have "mental illness." And this applies not only to veterans with PTSD, but to many other people who have some mental issues.
I know a teacher of grade school kids and his take of it the violent nutters are easy to spot at a early age because they haven't had time to learn how to hide it. Maybe if there's intervention at a early age we can treat and help these poor souls before they snap...

Just saying...
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  #37  
Old 02 Oct 17, 19:33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pamak View Post
Well, the NRA video contradicts much of what you say about the background checks.

Sorry, I made the mistake of relying on Illinois law rather than an NRA video.
I feel so stupid.
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  #38  
Old 02 Oct 17, 19:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cambronnne View Post
Sorry, I made the mistake of relying on Illinois law rather than an NRA video.
I feel so stupid.
It is okay. You can start with wiki to learn the basics and the difference between "federal" and "Illinois"
Then go back to the NRA video to hear (again) how states often undermine the federal process...




https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation...d_Check_System

The National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) is a U.S. system for determining if prospective firearms or explosives buyers' name and birth year match those of a person who is not eligible to buy. It was mandated by the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act (Brady Law) of 1993 and launched by the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) in 1998.
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Old 02 Oct 17, 20:27
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I still claim the problems are more of mental illness and the availability of guns to them is the problem. I saw a headline recently about a mom leaving a gun out and a toddler shooting a gun. That aint right.

Lock your guns in a gun safe or at least lock them.

Now in this case none of those options would apply.

Now this is a step in the right direction.

https://patriot1tech.com/solutions/how-it-works/
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  #40  
Old 02 Oct 17, 21:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pamak View Post
It is okay. You can start with wiki to learn the basics and the difference between "federal" and "Illinois"
Then go back to the NRA video to hear (again) how states often undermine the federal process...




https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation...d_Check_System

The National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) is a U.S. system for determining if prospective firearms or explosives buyers' name and birth year match those of a person who is not eligible to buy. It was mandated by the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act (Brady Law) of 1993 and launched by the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) in 1998.



I'm sorry. You said an unidentified NRA video contradicted my statement that background checks are already required. Now you are pointing out evidence that supports what I said and linking to the federal background check requirements.

Federal law requires the background check. Some states do not require additional checks, but that does not erase the federal requirements.

The cool thing about States is that they have the right to make their own laws and if the people of that state decide they want them changed, they can do so.
They don't have to make laws that satisfy people who don't live there.

So what was your point again?
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  #41  
Old 02 Oct 17, 22:40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SRV Ron View Post
How do you plan on banning everything that could possibly be used to kill including the use of one's fist and hands?
This is the same argument many people have made regarding action vs. inaction, so I'll use a medical analogy to help clarify the point.

For all practical purposes, cancer is incurable. There is no single treatment for "cancer" that is 100% guaranteed to be eliminate the disease. This is because there are many, many different types of cancer. Not only do different types of cancer respond differently to different treatment modalities, different individuals respond differently to the same treatment. So you usually treat cancer with a variety of tools hoping to get lucky.

It's kind of the same thing with gun violence. You use a variety of "modalities" to reduce the risk of people dying. You educate properly. You reduce access, you track purchases, you have consistent enforcement, you reduce the overall effectiveness of the weapons themselves. It's a layered approach. Over time, less people are injured by guns and those that are injured are injured less seriously, even though the problem is never really eliminated.

But first you have to want to solve the problem. If the NRA had been in charge of dictating of how to deal with cancer, they would have lobbied hard to do nothing because modern medicine has never been able to "cure" cancer. Surely you can see the absurdity of that approach.

We have WAY too many guns in this country that are WAY too good at killing people. It's insane.
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Old 02 Oct 17, 22:52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cambronnne View Post
I'm sorry. You said an unidentified NRA video contradicted my statement that background checks are already required.
I purchased a six shot revolver from Cabela's online. It was shipped to me in less than a week. All I needed way my credit card and driver's license number. I didn't fill out a single form.

It's a fully functioning replica of an 1860 .44 Colt revolver.

I suspect it was so easy to obtain because it's classified as a "black powder" weapon. Even though you load it with six rounds and you can slip it into your waistband and it's ready to go. Absolutely deadly at close range. Six shots.
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Old 02 Oct 17, 22:57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armor11 View Post
We have WAY too many guns in this country that are WAY too good at killing people. It's insane.
Like the 38,000+ killed by cars each year, many by drunken or drugged drivers and the stupid that are playing with their smart phones?

The problem is the insane, the stupid, and the criminals, which have been highly protected by the Progressive Left. One only has to look at the number of people killed by guns in DC, Chicago, and other cities where the law abiding are FORBIDDEN from possessing guns by local laws to see that gun control doesn't stop gun crime. Also the long arrest and slap on the hand records of those doing the shootings and how the cops have been handicapped by Obama into being racist if they attempt to arrest those committing those crimes.
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Old 02 Oct 17, 23:08
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armor11 View Post
I purchased a six shot revolver from Cabela's online. It was shipped to me in less than a week. All I needed way my credit card and driver's license number. I didn't fill out a single form.

It's a fully functioning replica of an 1860 .44 Colt revolver.

I suspect it was so easy to obtain because it's classified as a "black powder" weapon. Even though you load it with six rounds and you can slip it into your waistband and it's ready to go. Absolutely deadly at close range. Six shots.
It is because it is a black powder cap and ball single action revolver that doesn't use a cartridge. Reloading it takes considerable time unless you carry additional cylinders already loaded and are proficient at swapping them out.
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Old 02 Oct 17, 23:41
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Change the HIPA laws so medical records are available to the FBI when they do background checks.
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