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  #31  
Old 14 Sep 17, 15:31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phil74501 View Post
And then where are you going to find the crews? Just throwing a few hundreds guys onto a ship, and calling then a "crew," doesn't make them a real crew.

Also, if I'm not mistaken, the US Navy no longer owns that many, if any at all, merchant ships. I doubt many private companies are going to willingly loan the US Navy ships to be put into harms way.
merchant/old auxillaries. is that better? the government could have bought old merchants that would have otherwise been scrapped, to ensure sealift, and trade capability in the event of something like WWIII

crews, i repeat again 100,000+ reservists.
some re-training will be necessary, but it's not that big of a deal.
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  #32  
Old 14 Sep 17, 15:35
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Originally Posted by MarkV View Post
It's the difference between the military and the emergency services (fire, rescue, police etc). The military can put out fires, arrest people etc but there are legal ramifications unless you declare martial law and suspend civil law. Similarly on the high seas a navy can intercept and halt ships of a nation with which they are not at war but this breaks all sorts of international treaties going back to the declaration of London and the even earlier Paris declaration. This can cost - read about the Trent incident when the US government got taken to the legal cleaners.
there's a huge difference between military arresting people in their own country, stopping ships in international waters.

what you described is like putting 3 marines, with one of the marines in charge in a SWAT van and claiming it's not posse commitatus because there are 7 police officers there too.
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  #33  
Old 14 Sep 17, 15:37
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Originally Posted by General_Jacke View Post
there's a huge difference between military arresting people in their own country, stopping ships in international waters.

what you described is like putting 3 marines, with one of the marines in charge in a SWAT van and claiming it's not posse commitatus because there are 7 police officers there too.
It's more like there's less questioning if the USCG boards a ship vs. the USN doing it.
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  #34  
Old 14 Sep 17, 15:38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by General_Jacke View Post
merchant/old auxillaries. is that better? the government could have bought old merchants that would have otherwise been scrapped, to ensure sealift, and trade capability in the event of something like WWIII

crews, i repeat again 100,000+ reservists.
some re-training will be necessary, but it's not that big of a deal.
We have plenty of sealift, but you're not going to turn them into naval auxiliaries.
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  #35  
Old 14 Sep 17, 15:43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johns624 View Post
We have plenty of sealift, but you're not going to turn them into naval auxiliaries.
http://americanshipper.com/main/news...ine-60006.aspx

Do we???
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  #36  
Old 14 Sep 17, 15:43
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There are certainly enough officers on active duty. How many are fit to command a ship is up to interpretation. They could also take a levy of admirals at the Pentagon. We have so many in case we need them, right?

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  #37  
Old 14 Sep 17, 21:04
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johns624 View Post
We have plenty of sealift, but you're not going to turn them into naval auxiliaries.
again, if all they're being used for is to out gun unarmed merchant ships then use we can. quite easily. as stated before, just crane a bradley or a stryker on on to the bow, maybe weld a platform in to make sure the turret and barrel will have full freedom of movement, and a .50 each side and a 240 on the bridge wings, then helo falklands style.

if you dont want to appropriate ground vehicles to sit stationary to sea air then simply put a mk38 on a platform on the bow, or a recoilless rifle. hell it could be a mk38 mod0 and be just fine for the purpose.

the point being there are plenty of ships that could be cheaply pressed into service for the capacity of outgunning unarmed ships and scaring merchantmen.

it's a craft as old as guns on ships.
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  #38  
Old 14 Sep 17, 21:07
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this picture is dated 2013 but all of these would be capable of doing the job with minimal effort and money spent.

a gun with a mile or so range on the bow, CIWS on the superstructure, chaff, and some crew served weapons.
http://navy.memorieshop.com/Reserve-.../Piers-2-3.jpg

and that's only one of like 5 or 6 sets of reserves around the nation.
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  #39  
Old 14 Sep 17, 21:10
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oh look more examples of ships that can be cheaply and quickly given minimum armament to scare or outgun merchant ships.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...scrapheap.html

i mean really we could go on and on like this, the hardest part of sharing pictures as examples is finding relatively recent pictures
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  #40  
Old 14 Sep 17, 21:22
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USS Hornet is now a floating museum. It is not going anywhere! I would not trust the engines. When the Navy tried to activate some pre-loaded ships for Desert Storm, a number broke down and they had to be fixed. They might have had to hire foreign ships to take the cargoes. Any time you stop a main engine for long periods of time without maintenance stuff stops working. Look at cars that are not run for months at a time.

None of the ships pictured look like they make high speed. You might as well paint a big target on them for the Norks. Even if you can make an effective blockade line a hundred miles or so away, the Chinese will just allow them to unload there and will ship the cargoes by rail into North Korea. Why? Because they like to mess with us.

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  #41  
Old 15 Sep 17, 02:21
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Will NATO be involved in any operations to interdiction North Korean merchant shipping?
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Old 15 Sep 17, 04:40
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Not if they can help it! It would take almost all the European Union Navies to make a difference and they would have big targets on them. This is Trump's idea and he didn't check to see if the US Navy could match his bluster.

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Old 15 Sep 17, 07:17
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Not if they can help it! It would take almost all the European Union Navies to make a difference and they would have big targets on them. This is Trump's idea and he didn't check to see if the US Navy could match his bluster.

Pruitt
That seems to be the Donald's modus operandi; he let's his mouth write the check and the he expects someone else to foot the bill. But in fairness, our political leadership has been doing that with the Navy for a while.
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Old 15 Sep 17, 13:36
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Will NATO be involved in any operations to interdiction North Korean merchant shipping?
No reason for them to be. No NATO member was attacked.
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Old 17 Sep 17, 21:00
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Not if they can help it! It would take almost all the European Union Navies to make a difference and they would have big targets on them. This is Trump's idea and he didn't check to see if the US Navy could match his bluster.

Pruitt
i think people need to remember that trump is very used to negotiations. he comes out swinging with big claims and demands, but uses those as leverage in negotiations. (look at how has backed down on the wall in exchange for increase in other security measures.)

i doubt there was any realistic expectation for it to actually get approved after all it was withdrawn 48-72 hours later, it was likely more intended to make the point of "we're tired of pussy footing around and want some serious steps to be taken" it makes a question of how far, how much, how close to that would trump be willing to go?
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