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Europe Issues of modern Europe.

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  #1  
Old 03 Sep 17, 04:57
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Terror Checklist

So far the response to the jihadi terror campaign in Europe has shown up a consistent set of responses. These can form a useful focus for whether attitudes are changing significantly in the aftermath of the next attack and the others that seem inevitable to follow. ACG opinion always polarise rapidly on this subject so there is not a lot of value in arguing what should happen as few people want to change their position. The more important feature is whether big shifts in public opinion or the actions of politicians can be detected.

1) The focus is on superficial or tactical features such what the security services could have done better. Politicians and the media have no interest in exploring the root causes, such as the size of the Muslim population or the attitudes they hold.

2) Statements by politicians are essentially rhetoric, focused on 'values' and no practical solutions are proposed.

3) Social liberals lead the public response. The focus is on 'unity' vigils and lighting up of public buildings but then almost a carnival atmosphere of positivity about how strong multiculturalism is. This is the 'good' and 'correct' response as viewed by the media and politicians.

4) Any protest movement is given much less or no media publicity. If it is covered at all, it is a rally of alt-right Nazi's. Any protest movement is 'bad' and the 'wrong' response by the forces of evil that 'seek to divide us'.

5) The police begin an immediate focus on 'hate crime', saying or writing anything considered too negative about the Muslim community. The media are on high alert and report events down to things said in the school playground. The focus is on how terrible things are for the Muslim community rather than how exposed the rest of the population is to further attacks.

6) the Muslim community themselves offer limited or no protest against the attack, in stark contrast to the mobilisation seen over attacks on Muslims in Gaza etc. The main message is that the community is a victim of Islamophobia and holds no responsibility for the attack.

These are the common features so far and can be used to check if society is shifting or sticking with the same cultural response to jihadi attacks.
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Last edited by Escape2Victory; 03 Sep 17 at 05:03..
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  #2  
Old 03 Sep 17, 17:09
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Nice prose indeed.
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Old 03 Sep 17, 20:57
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Originally Posted by sebfrench76 View Post
Nice prose indeed.
Yes I agree. Well said indeed.
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Old 03 Sep 17, 23:50
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Yes I agree. Well said indeed.
Pretty much covers it... every single time.
I wonder if they can dress it up a little by blaming it all on Global Warming.
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Old 04 Sep 17, 07:02
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Well said, E2V.
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Old 04 Sep 17, 07:33
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These day here, it seems to be

"...shout Allah Ak'bar,.."

Check.

"Be shot dead by nearby military patrol."

Check.

"Complaints on internet."

Check.
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Old 04 Sep 17, 11:49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowygerry View Post
These day here, it seems to be

"...shout Allah Ak'bar,.."

Check.

"Be shot dead by nearby military patrol."

Check.

"Complaints on internet."

Check.
The failed attacks are quickly shrugged off for some reason. It is those that hit that register with the public, the ones where parents have to live the rest of their life without their child, or children who's parents never come home.
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Old 04 Sep 17, 13:27
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Those kinds of situations are unmitigated tragedies, and they happen — but frankly not often because of terror attacks.

The complaint here really seems to be that these societies absorb terrorist attacks, and then life goes on more or less as if the attacks had never taken place.

And that is a Bad Thing...?
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Old 04 Sep 17, 13:36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Escape2Victory View Post
So far the response to the jihadi terror campaign in Europe has shown up a consistent set of responses. These can form a useful focus for whether attitudes are changing significantly in the aftermath of the next attack and the others that seem inevitable to follow. ACG opinion always polarise rapidly on this subject so there is not a lot of value in arguing what should happen as few people want to change their position. The more important feature is whether big shifts in public opinion or the actions of politicians can be detected.

1) The focus is on superficial or tactical features such what the security services could have done better. Politicians and the media have no interest in exploring the root causes, such as the size of the Muslim population or the attitudes they hold.

2) Statements by politicians are essentially rhetoric, focused on 'values' and no practical solutions are proposed.

3) Social liberals lead the public response. The focus is on 'unity' vigils and lighting up of public buildings but then almost a carnival atmosphere of positivity about how strong multiculturalism is. This is the 'good' and 'correct' response as viewed by the media and politicians.

4) Any protest movement is given much less or no media publicity. If it is covered at all, it is a rally of alt-right Nazi's. Any protest movement is 'bad' and the 'wrong' response by the forces of evil that 'seek to divide us'.

5) The police begin an immediate focus on 'hate crime', saying or writing anything considered too negative about the Muslim community. The media are on high alert and report events down to things said in the school playground. The focus is on how terrible things are for the Muslim community rather than how exposed the rest of the population is to further attacks.

6) the Muslim community themselves offer limited or no protest against the attack, in stark contrast to the mobilisation seen over attacks on Muslims in Gaza etc. The main message is that the community is a victim of Islamophobia and holds no responsibility for the attack.

These are the common features so far and can be used to check if society is shifting or sticking with the same cultural response to jihadi attacks.
Enough of the white English Christian community of London supported the Muslim mayor. What did you think of the many white English Christian men and women whom voted for the Muslim mayor of London. Are those white Christians a part of the "jihadi" problem?

I note you bring up Muslims in Gaza itt. You did that, why?

What does the good looking English Muslim man or women who drinks Jack Daniels have to due with the Muslims in Gaza?

You used the term the Muslim community, are you saying all Muslims are the same,

https://www.google.com/search?q=prof...TAvkCW--PFa7M:

https://www.google.com/search?q=prof...TAvkCW--PFa7M:

https://www.google.com/search?newwin...k1.LUQZMGnFHDo

That said what is the solution to the problems that you think exist, perhaps you want Islam banned from England? Im generally interested in what you have to say same as what the folks over at stromfront say about Jewish immigration, etc. Sure some may be offended but I stand by your free speech.
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Old 04 Sep 17, 13:42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johan Banér View Post
Those kinds of situations are unmitigated tragedies, and they happen — but frankly not often because of terror attacks.

The complaint here really seems to be that these societies absorb terrorist attacks, and then life goes on more or less as if the attacks had never taken place.

And that is a Bad Thing...?
Put it in privative terms, since that is what you have invited in-

The woman that always submits to Rape and then just walks away as if nothing had ever taken place is going to become very popular ... with the very worst sort of men.
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Old 04 Sep 17, 13:53
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Originally Posted by Gixxer86g View Post
Well said, E2V.
Was it? What was the intent? And what about the white European Muslims whose Islamic traditions go back centuries. Anti Muslims never talk about white Muslims they only talk about big bearded thobe wearing arabs.



Brother the sites you and Exorcist read get away from the honorable message of Muhammad, David, Jesus and all the great men and women of history. Your sights never have stories like the following,

Hero' Muslim man helps catch gang attacking people 'because they were white Christians' in Liverpool

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7866951.html
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Old 04 Sep 17, 13:56
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I vote for the Brit anti-immigration UKIP party, so remember everybody, we can use our votes to get rid of politicians who we don't like, just as the great American people trashed Hillary..
If we vote for fools, we only have ourselves to blame for the ensuing mess..
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Old 04 Sep 17, 14:04
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Originally Posted by Poor Old Spike View Post
I vote for the Brit anti-immigration UKIP party, so remember everybody, we can use our votes to get rid of politicians who we don't like, just as the great American people trashed Hillary..
If we vote for fools, we only have ourselves to blame for the ensuing mess..
"Which is the greater fool, the fool or the fool who follows him?"- Obi-Wan Kenobi.

Why vote for Ukip? I honestly ask do you for example want to see Islam banned in England like how Christianity is effectively banned in Saudi Arabia.

These topics can be touchy for some, let me say though Im open to hearing your ideas.

One thing that interests me greatly is would you support a friend or relative whom married a Muslim?
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Old 04 Sep 17, 14:31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johan Banér View Post
Those kinds of situations are unmitigated tragedies, and they happen — but frankly not often because of terror attacks.

The complaint here really seems to be that these societies absorb terrorist attacks, and then life goes on more or less as if the attacks had never taken place.

And that is a Bad Thing...?
My thesis is that accidents happen but attacks are something different and the cultural nature of jihadi attacks is something different again. I know we don't all agree on the significance of these attacks and we won't agree. The point is to use this checklist to see if societies in Western Europe retain the same responses or if things start to change with the enivateble attacks to come.
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Old 05 Sep 17, 04:12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Exorcist View Post
Put it in privative terms, since that is what you have invited in-

The woman that always submits to Rape and then just walks away as if nothing had ever taken place is going to become very popular ... with the very worst sort of men.
Oh, the private terms here are all in the eye of the beholder, i.e. yours.

But I think your post here is quite revelatory. (Though it makes on wonder why you would frame such an elaborate OP, if the whole thing was going to head to beaten-wife-metaphors being applied to Europeans anyway?)

Israel works like I described. Hell, they even consciously PLAN for it, by having clean-up crews descend on all sites of terrorist attacks, precisely to make sure as little as possible can be seen as soon as possible. And it's perfectly consciously done, so as to make sure normalcy can be regained asap. That is cosmetics, clearly being conscious about the look of the thing. (Thing is, it works.)

But going by your metaphorics here, that amounts to Israel, the beaten wife, slapping on an extra layer of make-up, and refusing to acknowledge what just happened.

Except I suspect you wouldn't apply this imagery to Israel, right? And you wouldn't about the US either? Which means it is specifically about Europeans.

OK, running with that, so the problem with Europeans is that we are effeminate, passive, and have brought these terror attacks on ourselves somehow, since we're just to chickenpoo to leave our abusive husband (the dick-swinging Islamist terrorists), and in denial. Wholly contemptible.

Considering this is stock, conservative US anti-europeanism, with no actual relevance to the recent spate of terrorism, it's hard to so why we should pay attention to it? It's not even arguably wrong in some interesting way, it's just so out of left-field irrelevant there's nothing to discuss.

And we're back to the fact that despite the Daesh terror (a sign of desperation on their part), and that the terrorism is supposed to try to force our societies to overreact in some way, and it's failing — this to you is still A Bad Thing (thanks for confirming that suspicion btw).

Which is why I tend to conclude that if forced to pick a side between the Islamist terrorist and the European societies they attack, to try to force them into making mistakes, you might actually favour the terrorists?

They might be brutal and beastly, but those make for pretty good characteristics of masculinity. Instead you seem to reserve as special disgust for the odious, effeminate, womanlike Europeans they're attacking. And when the Europeans don't go all to pieces, just absorb the attacks (we have 150 years of collective experience of this sort of thing) that is the Wrong Response. While if something similar happens in places it seems reasonable to infer you approve of, the US, Israel, odds are you would instead consider it wholly appropriate I imagine? (Yes, it looks to me as if you're applying a double standard here.)

It even used to be a US line about it being morally superior to Europe, for us having the phenomenon of terrorism while the US didn't; it's more of the this US anti-Europeanism, except things seem to have have shifted a bit in recent years as terrorism of this kind appeared in the US too.

Regardless, since the European societies being struck by these Islamist terrorist attacks so far just absorb them — actually they have acted a bit surprised about their own phlegmatic response, displaying "la courage anglaise" as the French would put it (i.e. cold-bloodedness); i.e. there was in Europe initially, when the first attacks occurred, considerably more fear that our societies might prove brittle after all, except they haven't — which indicates they are not even close to any kind of breaking point.

So I feel you are going to have to go on being frustrated about the European response (or lack of) to these terrorist attacks. Since we can assume there will be more of them, likely soon.
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