HistoryNet.com RSS
ArmchairGeneral.com RSS

HistoryNet.com Articles
America's Civil War
American History
Aviation History
Civil War Times
MHQ
Military History
Vietnam
Wild West
World War II

ACG Online
ACG Magazine
Stuff We Like
War College
History News
Tactics 101
Carlo D'Este
Books

ACG Gaming
Boardgames
PC Game Reviews

ACG Network
Contact Us
Our Newsletter
Meet Our Staff
Advertise With Us

Sites We Support
HistoryNet.com
StreamHistory.com
Once A Marine
The Art of Battle
Game Squad
Mil. History Podcast
Russian Army - WW2
Achtung Panzer!
Mil History Online

Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Current Events > Europe

Notices and Announcements

Europe Issues of modern Europe.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #31  
Old 25 Sep 17, 02:21
ljadw's Avatar
ljadw ljadw is offline
General of the Forums
Belgium
5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: zottegem
Posts: 14,346
ljadw gives and gets respect [800]
ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acheron View Post
FFS, does that insipid idea still hold on? Do people honestly believe, that a head of government deliberately invited a hordes of foreigners into the country, rubbing her hand in glee while dreaming about being raped? Is it too big a stretch of imagination, that a couple of thousand people camping at the Budapest station were told to come in, but that erroneous news spread via social media that it was an all around "come in as you please" event, and that stopping the refugees by force was morally repugnant to a nation where the local version of the bible does not feature Jesus founding the NRA?

Who am I kidding, of course it is. Because governments that run the DRM or British Rail are obviously so perfect and infallible that they couldn't possibly make a mistake and loose control. It is the same logic that fuels the 9/11 "Truthers".
She was chancellor,thus she was responsible, and she is still refusing a Obergrenze = a limit to the number of Muslim immigrants that may go to Germany .

She is responsible for the catastrophe that has happened, she was warned, but she refused to listen : she knew better .
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 25 Sep 17, 02:26
ljadw's Avatar
ljadw ljadw is offline
General of the Forums
Belgium
5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: zottegem
Posts: 14,346
ljadw gives and gets respect [800]
ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800]
Merkel was also candidate for the Bundestag and in her own district in Mecklenburg-Vorpommern,she got 44 % of the votes, 4 years ago :56 % .

The German electors were voting twice yesterday : one vote for a candidate (Direktmandat) and another for the party (Zweitstim) .
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 25 Sep 17, 03:06
TuffGong's Avatar
TuffGong TuffGong is offline
Lieutenant Colonel
Germany
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Rhein-Ruhr
Posts: 1,410
TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruitt View Post
The attached article did not say the CDU got 44%, it said 33%. I still say I am uneasy with this way to hold an election.

Pruitt
Merkel got at her home voting district 44 % on the first vote. So she is direct voted into the parliament. 33 % got the right wing partys, CDU/CSU, in Germany total on the second vote.

At least: As long as the SPD is not willing to go into power there will be no chance for Merkel to become Kanzler again. She has to deal with the far-right CSU, her own right-wing party, the one-man-band FDP and the disturbing Greens. I think, it can't work.

We will see a second election very soon.
__________________
Mundstuhl - We Germans
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 25 Sep 17, 06:57
ljadw's Avatar
ljadw ljadw is offline
General of the Forums
Belgium
5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: zottegem
Posts: 14,346
ljadw gives and gets respect [800]
ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800]
The prognosis is no government before Christmas . I heard that there are a lot of queues before certain shops : all CDU /CSU prominents who want to buy big knives to stab in the back of Angela . Seehofer ordered them at Amazon last month, he knew what was coming .
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 25 Sep 17, 07:27
TuffGong's Avatar
TuffGong TuffGong is offline
Lieutenant Colonel
Germany
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Rhein-Ruhr
Posts: 1,410
TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99]
Quote:
Originally Posted by ljadw View Post
The prognosis is no government before Christmas . I heard that there are a lot of queues before certain shops : all CDU /CSU prominents who want to buy big knives to stab in the back of Angela . Seehofer ordered them at Amazon last month, he knew what was coming .
Yes, the big question is if CDU and CSU will do a cooperation in the next legislature. The CSU lost a lot and next year are elections in Bavaria.

Here some respectable summary of the election:

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...the-polls.html

BERLIN—German Chancellor Angela Merkel won a fourth term Sunday, but now faces the tricky prospect of forming a coalition with two disparate new partners after voters weakened her conservatives and a nationalist, anti-migrant party surged into parliament.

Merkel’s centre-left challenger, Martin Schulz, conceded that his Social Democrats had suffered a “crushing election defeat,” with projections showing the party’s worst performance in post-Second World War Germany.

He vowed to take his party, the junior partner in Merkel’s outgoing “grand coalition” of Germany’s traditionally dominant parties, into opposition.

“We have a mandate to form a new government, and no government can be formed against us,” Merkel told cheering supporters. She added that it wasn’t a “matter of course” to finish first after 12 years in power, and that the past four years were “extremely challenging.”

Stressing that “we live in stormy times” internationally, she declared: “I have the intention of achieving a stable government in Germany.”

The biggest winner was the four-year-old Alternative for Germany, or AfD. It finished third after a campaign that centred on shrill criticism of Merkel and her decision in 2015 to allow large numbers of migrants into Germany, but also harnessed wider discontent with established politicians.

One of AfD’s leaders, Alice Weidel, said it will provide “constructive opposition.” But co-leader Alexander Gauland struck a harsher tone, vowing that “we will take our country back” and promising to “chase” Merkel.

Final results released shortly before 10 p.m. Eastern Time on Sunday showed Merkel’s Christian Democratic Union and their Bavaria-only allies, the Christian Social Union, winning 33 per cent of the vote — down from 41.5 per cent four years ago. It was one of their weakest postwar showings.
__________________
Mundstuhl - We Germans
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 25 Sep 17, 07:39
101combatvet's Avatar
101combatvet 101combatvet is offline
General of the Forums
United_States
5 Year Service Ribbon Best Pin-Up Of World War II Most Significant/Influential Tank Campaign Most Significant/Influential Fighter Campaign 
Most Significant/Influential Multi-Role Aircraft C Greatest/Best Tank of WW2 Campaign 
 
Real Name: Shooter
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: NYC, Chesapeake Bay or Lima
Posts: 15,776
101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] 101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000]
101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] 101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] 101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] 101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] 101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] 101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] 101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] 101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] 101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] 101combatvet has set a fine example for others to follow [1000]


Quote:
Originally Posted by Reimnitz View Post
Chancellor Merkel is the most able political leader in Europe, maybe even the entire world. Germany is thriving under her stewardship. You have only to compare the shambolic antics of Donald Trump and the equally chaotic Theresa May in the UK to grasp how strong and principled she is. Prost, Frau Kanzlerin!
__________________
My worst jump story:
My 13th jump was on the 13th day of the month, aircraft number 013.
As recorded on my DA Form 1307 Individual Jump Log.
No lie.

~
"Everything looks all right. Have a good jump, eh."
-2 Commando Jumpmaster
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 25 Sep 17, 12:13
Skoblin's Avatar
Skoblin Skoblin is offline
ACG Forums - Field Marshal
Pirate
Distinguished Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon Greatest Westerns Campaign Greatest Spy Movies Campaign 
Greatest Blunders Campaign Best Pin-Up Of World War II Most Significant/Influential Tank Campaign Most Significant/Influential Fighter Campaign 
Most Significant/Influential Multi-Role  Aircraft SPQR Campaign Greatest/Best Tank of WW2 Campaign 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: The city on the river
Posts: 17,477
Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+]
Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Skoblin has achieved enlightenment [1200+]
AfD co-leader Frauke Petry has resigned from the party caucus and will sit as an independent

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...n-breakthrough
__________________
This area for rent. Contact me for details..
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 25 Sep 17, 17:46
bierbaron's Avatar
bierbaron bierbaron is offline
Sergeant Major
Germany
Greatest/Best Tank of WW2 Campaign 
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: In Germany
Posts: 348
bierbaron is on the path to success [1-99] bierbaron is on the path to success [1-99] bierbaron is on the path to success [1-99] bierbaron is on the path to success [1-99] bierbaron is on the path to success [1-99] bierbaron is on the path to success [1-99]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skoblin View Post
AfD co-leader Frauke Petry has resigned from the party caucus and will sit as an independent

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...n-breakthrough
Well i don't know if its post pregnancy depressions or if she was just a state paid infiltrator but Petry's behaviour has been obnoxious. You don't stab party colleagues like Höcke in the back over nothing. In my little opinion she was just another Merkel and its good such persons are stopped right at the beginning.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 27 Sep 17, 09:30
Tuebor's Avatar
Tuebor Tuebor is offline
First Lieutenant
United_States
 
Real Name: Michael
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Monroe
Posts: 542
Tuebor is on the path to success [1-99] Tuebor is on the path to success [1-99] Tuebor is on the path to success [1-99] Tuebor is on the path to success [1-99] Tuebor is on the path to success [1-99] Tuebor is on the path to success [1-99]
Quote:
Originally Posted by ljadw View Post
Merkel was also candidate for the Bundestag and in her own district in Mecklenburg-Vorpommern,she got 44 % of the votes, 4 years ago :56 % .

The German electors were voting twice yesterday : one vote for a candidate (Direktmandat) and another for the party (Zweitstim) .
Can someone explain to me (in small simple words) just how the friggin hell German elections work? I am sooo confused.

Thank you.

Tuebor
(My head hurts).
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 27 Sep 17, 10:38
Half Pint John's Avatar
Half Pint John Half Pint John is offline
General of the Forums
United_States
Distinguished Service Award ACG Ten Year Service Award 5 Year Service Ribbon March Offensive 
Summer Campaign 100 Greatest Generals, 2008 Most Decisive Battle Campaign, 2008 Greatest Westerns Campaign 
Greatest Spy Movies Campaign Greatest Blunders Campaign Best Pin-Up Of World War II Most Significant/Influential Tank Campaign 
Most Significant/Influential Fighter Campaign Most Significant/Influential Multi-Role Aircraft C 
 
Real Name: John (NO LABELS)
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Stuttgart Germany
Posts: 47,151
Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+]  [+1]
Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Half Pint John has achieved enlightenment [1200+]
Quote:
Originally Posted by TuffGong View Post
Merkel got at her home voting district 44 % on the first vote. So she is direct voted into the parliament. 33 % got the right wing partys, CDU/CSU, in Germany total on the second vote.

At least: As long as the SPD is not willing to go into power there will be no chance for Merkel to become Kanzler again. She has to deal with the far-right CSU, her own right-wing party, the one-man-band FDP and the disturbing Greens. I think, it can't work.

We will see a second election very soon.
The CSU is far right????????????????? Why did the Far Right AfD do so well in Bayren? I'll buy right wing party but Hardly call the CSU Far Right.
__________________
"Ask not what your country can do for you"

Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power.

'half-baked, spurious nationalism'
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links

  #41  
Old 27 Sep 17, 10:54
MarkV's Avatar
MarkV MarkV is offline
General of the Forums
UK
Most Significant/Influential Multi-Role Aircraft C 
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Tenbury Wells
Posts: 12,150
MarkV is simply cracking [600]
MarkV is simply cracking [600] MarkV is simply cracking [600] MarkV is simply cracking [600] MarkV is simply cracking [600] MarkV is simply cracking [600] MarkV is simply cracking [600] MarkV is simply cracking [600] MarkV is simply cracking [600] MarkV is simply cracking [600] MarkV is simply cracking [600] MarkV is simply cracking [600] MarkV is simply cracking [600]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuebor View Post
Can someone explain to me (in small simple words) just how the friggin hell German elections work? I am sooo confused.

Thank you.

Tuebor
(My head hurts).
In much the same way as Scotch ones do - they use a similar system intended to encourage coalitions

I don't have the German one but here is the Scottish

Quote:
The parliament, which will sit for a four-year term, will consist of 129 members.

They will be known as Members of the Scottish Parliament, or MSPs, and will be chosen in one of two ways:

73 members representing individual constituencies and elected under the traditional First Past The Post system.
These will be the same as the 72 Scottish constituencies at Westminster with the exception that Orkney and Shetland will be divided into two, each electing its own MSP.

56 members selected from 'party lists' in the country's eight electoral regions.
These regions are the same as the current European parliamentary boundaries and each will elect seven MSPs through the Additional Member System, a form of proportional representation.

Electors will therefore have two votes on separate ballot papers. One for a candidate in their constituency (mauve ballot paper) and one for a party list in their region (peach ballot paper).
Probably need a glass of Scotch for greater clarity
__________________
Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 27 Sep 17, 15:30
ljadw's Avatar
ljadw ljadw is offline
General of the Forums
Belgium
5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: zottegem
Posts: 14,346
ljadw gives and gets respect [800]
ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800] ljadw gives and gets respect [800]
It's much more complicated than that :


First vote : winner takes all : 299 electoral districts .


Second vote : for the party : also 299 seats Proportional system .

The second vote determines the total of seats a party can have .

But :

1) If a party has less elected candidates in the electoral districts than the total number of seats have right to ?

Example : party A has right to 48 seats but has only 40 elected candidates in the first vote :the solution is that the 8 other seats are given to candidates who failed to be elected .



2) The opposite : if a party had more elected candidates in the electoral districts than it had right to ?

Example = party B has right to 20 seats but has 25 direct elected candidates ?

The party conserves its 25 seats, but the other parties receive a compensation in additional seats .

The result is that one knows never in advance the number of people who will seat in the Bundestag .

In 1949 : 402, 1953 : 487, 1957 : 497 ,1961 :521 , 1965 : 496 ,etc

2013 : 631, 2017 :598

This was also during Weimar, but for another reason : the number of seats depended on the number of votes .

There is also an electoral treshold of 5 %, but ,...with an exception :A party with 2 % and 3 directly elected candidates,conserves its 3 seats .
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 28 Sep 17, 07:22
TuffGong's Avatar
TuffGong TuffGong is offline
Lieutenant Colonel
Germany
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Rhein-Ruhr
Posts: 1,410
TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99]
Quote:
Originally Posted by ljadw View Post
It's much more complicated than that :


First vote : winner takes all : 299 electoral districts .


Second vote : for the party : also 299 seats Proportional system .

The second vote determines the total of seats a party can have .

But :

1) If a party has less elected candidates in the electoral districts than the total number of seats have right to ?

Example : party A has right to 48 seats but has only 40 elected candidates in the first vote :the solution is that the 8 other seats are given to candidates who failed to be elected .



2) The opposite : if a party had more elected candidates in the electoral districts than it had right to ?

Example = party B has right to 20 seats but has 25 direct elected candidates ?

The party conserves its 25 seats, but the other parties receive a compensation in additional seats .

The result is that one knows never in advance the number of people who will seat in the Bundestag .

In 1949 : 402, 1953 : 487, 1957 : 497 ,1961 :521 , 1965 : 496 ,etc

2013 : 631, 2017 :598

This was also during Weimar, but for another reason : the number of seats depended on the number of votes .

There is also an electoral treshold of 5 %, but ,...with an exception :A party with 2 % and 3 directly elected candidates,conserves its 3 seats .
In the Bundestag 2017 we have 709 seats.
__________________
Mundstuhl - We Germans
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 28 Sep 17, 07:28
TuffGong's Avatar
TuffGong TuffGong is offline
Lieutenant Colonel
Germany
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Rhein-Ruhr
Posts: 1,410
TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99] TuffGong is on the path to success [1-99]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Half Pint John View Post
The CSU is far right????????????????? Why did the Far Right AfD do so well in Bayren? I'll buy right wing party but Hardly call the CSU Far Right.
For people from West-Germany the CSU was always a far right group which were interested in to look for a partnership with the right winger CDU to make the people believe they are not far right. Have a look on the actual trouble between CDU and CSU. Clear a identification for that one group is a right winger and the other group a far right winger. They try to copy some AfD-Elements are comparing with their far right ideologies. The CSU ist some kind of a "Wolf im Schafspelz".
__________________
Mundstuhl - We Germans
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 29 Sep 17, 21:18
Acheron's Avatar
Acheron Acheron is offline
Lieutenant General
Germany
5 Year Service Ribbon 
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Near Munich
Posts: 3,052
Acheron has a spectacular aura about [400]
Acheron has a spectacular aura about [400] Acheron has a spectacular aura about [400] Acheron has a spectacular aura about [400]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuebor View Post
Can someone explain to me (in small simple words) just how the friggin hell German elections work? I am sooo confused.

Thank you.

Tuebor
(My head hurts).
Will do my best:
During a federal election, every voter has two votes on his ballot called "Erststimme" (primary vote" and "Zweitstimme(secondary vote).

Regarding the first column for the "Erststimme":
The Federal Republic of Germany is divided into districts (Wahlkreise") for the purpose of the election. With your "Erststimme" you vote between different PERSONS. The PERSON that gets the most votes within a single district get elected to parliament. The persons you can vote for usually are party affiliated, but this is not a requirement.

Regarding the second column for the "Zweitstimme":
Here, you can only vote for political PARTIES, not persons. The ratio of votes HAS to reflect the ratio of seats in parliament.

Now it gets complicated:
The Bundestag (federal diet) nominally has 598 members. There are 299 districts (the "Wahlbezirke" for the "Erststimme"). So, the basic idea is, that half of the diet is chosen directly by the voters. The other half is determined by the political parties, who create "lists" of people who will go for them to parliament for the second, not directly chosen half.

Exmaples ought to help_
A party gets 10% of the secondary votes ("Zweitstimme"). It is thus entitled to 10% of the seats in the Bundestag (let's just round it up to 60 for the purpose of this example). In 15 districs, party members got the most primary votes. Thus, 15 members of the party are already in parliament for it. This leaves 45 more. Thus, the first 45 people on the list get elected to parliament. The guy placed 45th on the list get to go to parliament, the on on place 46 does not.

Now, a party may be entitled to only, say, 60 seats in parliament, but win for example in 70 districts. Thus, they send 70 people to parliament. The German constitutional court has decided, that in this case, the other parties must get extra seats, the ratio of seats MUST reflect the ratio of secondary votes. The court ruled it unconstitutional that a party, or coalition of parties, could have a majority in parliament without having a majority of the secondary votes.


All in all, it is an admittedly complicated system, but bear two things in mind:
1st) The German constitution is relatively young, it was created, while not in the age of computers, in the age of telecommunications and established bureaucracies who could handle such a system.
3rd) It was created by and for a people that had fallen to and followed the most atrocious regime of history. For the men who crafted our current system, prevention of anything like it happening again was paramount. The first attempt at democracy (the Weimar republic) ended in literally the worst possible way. The Federal Constitution was not crafted by misty-eyed idealists who thought everything will be all right because the people are always right, nor by cynical members of the very system they were creating, instead it was made by shocked veterans who had witnessed the depths to which a people can willingly sink.
__________________
Reaction to the 2016 Munich shootings:
Europe: "We are shocked and support you in these harsh times, we stand by you."
USA: "We will check people from Germany extra-hard and it is your own damn fault for being so stupid."
Reply With Quote
Reply

Please bookmark this thread if you enjoyed it!


Thread Tools
Display Modes



Forum Jump

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 20:44.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.