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Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Books, Film and Media > Film, DVD, and TV

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Film, DVD, and TV Discuss the latest movies at the theatre and on DVD, as well as what is on TV. ACG film reviews will also be found here.

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  #16  
Old 25 Jul 17, 11:30
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^
I agree, the obvious thing to me was the lack of CGI to fill up the screen with more aircraft, people, wreaks, etc.

But I suspect that it was intentional as Nolan was focused on human trauma.
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  #17  
Old 25 Jul 17, 11:34
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Originally Posted by Cult Icon View Post
^
I agree, the obvious thing to me was the lack of CGI to fill up the screen with more aircraft, people, wreaks, etc.

But I suspect that it was intentional as Nolan was focused on human trauma.
It wasn't about 400,000 men getting to England, it was about a few men surviving the historic events going on around them. The opening sequence tells us this will be a personal-level saga.
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  #18  
Old 25 Jul 17, 11:59
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Originally Posted by OpanaPointer View Post
It wasn't about 400,000 men getting to England, it was about a few men surviving the historic events going on around them. The opening sequence tells us this will be a personal-level saga.
yes, I agree.

Normally the background would be filled with CGI or props/extra

An extreme example of this is the corny Hacksaw Ridge movie.
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  #19  
Old 25 Jul 17, 18:26
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According to Osprey booklet, Operation Dynamo:


Quote:
While successful, Dynamo was a costly operation, especially for the naval
forces. By the time it ended at 1423hrs on 4 June the Allies had lost 240
vessels with another 45 badly damaged. Most grievous of course were Royal
Navy and French destroyer losses. Six British and three French warships of
this category were sunk and 26 damaged.

For the RAF Dynamo was an expensive learning experience. A close
examination of Luftwaffe loss reports and unit operational records reveals
that British fighters destroyed 42 bombers and 36 fighters over Dunkirk.
(Additionally, four Stukas and two Ju 88s are known to have fallen to ships’
anti-aircraft fire.) In return Air Vice-Marshal Park’s 11 Group lost 84 fighters
to Messerschmitts and bombers’ defensive fire, thus costing more than one
fighter for each enemy aircraft downed. Fighter Command’s front-line strength
was reduced to only 331 Spitfires and Hurricanes with 36 in reserve.
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  #20  
Old 25 Jul 17, 20:40
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Originally Posted by Cult Icon View Post
I saw the movie over the weekend. The movie is all activity and action with limited dialogue. It's basically a series of crises and disasters strung together. The director focuses on the traumatic experiences of the men involved and how they confront them. It's very impressive, unique, and overwhelming but not really a historical film. Dunkirk is just a convenient setting. The film succeeds in creating a high level of tension and fear.
Agreed, but I also think it is more than historical enough. I mean, how many people in the 15-35 age range were even aware of "the Little Ships" saga until just recently?


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Originally Posted by Cult Icon View Post
The Germans in the film are barely visible boogymen/monsters. A couple HE-111 medium bombers and numerous, scattered ME-109 fighters and Stuka dive bombers. There is an invisible U-boat that torpedos ships.
It is pretty amazing how little you see of the enemy in practice, and how little shooting you get to do in relation to how much seems to come flying your way!

I was watching to see if the main Spitfire put out more than 15 seconds of fire from his guns. He did not... impressive, ain't it?

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Originally Posted by Cult Icon View Post
I would need to watch it a second time to catch everything that I missed.
Yeah, I think everyone is.
Heh heh, I just realized, that was probably done on purpose.
This could turn out to be the most watched movie since Titanic. 50 $ million on its first weekend, in fact.

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Originally Posted by Cult Icon View Post
The ships, aircraft, and equipment depicted in the film appear to be entirely real. The props are particularly good and so are the vistas. I especially like how the British soldiers were all skinny men (typical of the 1940s). A minor limitation however, is that since Nolan used real props he was limited in how much he could depict at once. (eg. it doesn't make sense that there are only 3 Spitfires in the whole film, or how the Luftwaffe anti-shipping sorties are in trios( 1 HE-111 with 2 ME-109 as escorts). But this filed using the real thing!
You might not want to hear this, but the rumor is that about 5 million $ worth of antiques were wrecked filming this thing. I don't know how many aircraft that would be, some boats must have been ruined too.

I did the math in my head, and to have 3 x Spits over that place at all times during the day would mean about 75 sorties. That isn't counting flights deeper into the flight-paths of the German planes, and everything else going on at the time... and they only had about 400 RAF fighters at the time, right?
Yeah, I can see a flight of three on their own, once in a while.


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From the cinematic view point. I think what Nolan did is new, refreshing and will be difficult to surpass. I did like the shifting timelines merging into one. Yes, I understand it confused many but I was able to see where it was going after a short while.
I LOVE the fact that here, at last, is a movie that isn't "dumbed-down" for a general audience.
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I think Nolan could have done much better in the historical sense, but we can't seem to discuss this without getting the thread locked, so I'll not bring it up..
Why?
Keep it dispassionate and accurate. But also , keep in mind that it is a hour & 45 min movie about a huge event that 95% of the people out there had no idea even happened.

Here is a sequence that I think should have been kept in the movie -
(Yes, 5 minutes, one shot)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QijbOCvunfU


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  #21  
Old 25 Jul 17, 22:25
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Originally Posted by The Exorcist View Post
Here is a sequence that I think should have been kept in the movie -
(Yes, 5 minutes, one shot)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QijbOCvunfU


This actually makes me think of a larger question....I can't help but wonder if there may be a "Director's Cut" of Dunkirk with unseen and/or previously edited scenes.
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  #22  
Old 25 Jul 17, 22:42
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While I think this sequence is awesome from a technical point of view, especially the continuous camera movement, it is SO theatrical to the point that it actually looks staged.

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Originally Posted by The Exorcist View Post

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  #23  
Old 26 Jul 17, 05:43
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Interesting little snippet from the BBC this morning. It seems that some of the French media have been a bit sniffy about it (usual moans about ignoring the French already done to death elsewhere in ACG) but that the French public apparently are/will be turning up in droves to see it.
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Old 26 Jul 17, 06:14
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It didn't seem that impressive to me. Maybe I was expecting more action and/or a bigger historical snapshot of the whole thing.

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Old 26 Jul 17, 07:22
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Interesting little snippet from the BBC this morning. It seems that some of the French media have been a bit sniffy about it (usual moans about ignoring the French already done to death elsewhere in ACG) but that the French public apparently are/will be turning up in droves to see it.

This is not what the box office is stating. Naturally, there would be more interest in France because after all....it was film in France, based on an event in France. Despite an article with people from Dunkirk saying the city was "punk'd", there are some who went to see it anyway.

The result is still less than a $5 million revenue for the film to date. Le Monde praise the film for it's artistic merit but blasted it's historical inaccuracies.

In the US, the film made $57 million
Canada resulted in $56.9 million
Others here:
http://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Dun...=international
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Old 26 Jul 17, 07:51
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The result is still less than a $5 million revenue for the film to date. Le Monde praise the film for it's artistic merit but blasted it's historical inaccuracies.
http://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Dun...=international
Says there opening weekend figures, so not bad.

What historical inaccuracies did Le Monde 'blast' out of interest?
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Old 26 Jul 17, 09:30
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Says there opening weekend figures, so not bad.
I'm not saying it's bad per se...but I certainly wouldn't describe "droves" of people flocking to see it either....

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Originally Posted by Gooner View Post
What historical inaccuracies did Le Monde 'blast' out of interest?
Besides the obvious lack of French representation (20-25 seconds?)....
there was mention that historically Dunkirk was over 80% destroyed, though in the film only a wooden gate suffered a few bullet holes, but otherwise the city appeared unscathed and intact.

Like I said earlier...Nolan's choice to not use CGI was very commendable IMO, but I don't think he should have dismissed it entirely. Some scenes could have used it, even if minimally.

The Silver Lining is that some believe the film may generate additional interest in Dunkirk and the historical events which occurred there (tourism).....inevitably they may learn about things not made apparent in the film.
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Old 26 Jul 17, 09:54
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It was kind of a plot point at the end to show the audience that not everyone came out of this massive evacuation.

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And why didn't the Spitfire pilot land in the sea like his wingman did earlier or bail out over/close to the friendly beach section instead of going into captivity?
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Old 26 Jul 17, 10:46
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Besides the obvious lack of French representation (20-25 seconds?)....
there was mention that historically Dunkirk was over 80% destroyed, though in the film only a wooden gate suffered a few bullet holes, but otherwise the city appeared unscathed and intact.
Fionn Whitehead moved through the city at the risk of his own life. He gets, IIRC, fourteen rounds thrown at him before he gets clear of the Germans. This is in town. Then the action moves to the beach, so no, we didn't see much of the city after that.

The English made a movie about the English experience at Dunkirk.
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Old 26 Jul 17, 11:04
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I'm not saying it's bad per se...but I certainly wouldn't describe "droves" of people flocking to see it either....
Almost 5 million bucks for a foreign film in just the first three days is pretty good isn't it?

Quote:
Besides the obvious lack of French representation (20-25 seconds?)....
there was mention that historically Dunkirk was over 80% destroyed, though in the film only a wooden gate suffered a few bullet holes, but otherwise the city appeared unscathed and intact.

Like I said earlier...Nolan's choice to not use CGI was very commendable IMO, but I don't think he should have dismissed it entirely. Some scenes could have used it, even if minimally.

The Silver Lining is that some believe the film may generate additional interest in Dunkirk and the historical events which occurred there (tourism).....inevitably they may learn about things not made apparent in the film.
Perhaps the British and French should make a co-production - I'm sure that would work

I don't think that town in the beginning could even have been Dunkirk - the Germans got nowhere near it until 4th June ...
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