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Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Historical Events & Eras > American Age of Discovery, Colonization, Revolution, & Expansion

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American Age of Discovery, Colonization, Revolution, & Expansion Military history of North America. .

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  #1  
Old 19 Mar 17, 06:44
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Good Doc, great scenery

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  #2  
Old 19 Mar 17, 12:57
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Thanks for posting. Looks very interesting.
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Old 19 Mar 17, 13:15
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Originally Posted by Half Pint John View Post
Ray Mears does a good job on Wild Historical Documents I've seen Wild France the European Beaver was almost trapped into extinction as was the American Beaver here.
Maybe the most important thing in the exploration of America was the question of transportation.
Horse-Mule-Oxen: http://oregonpioneers.com/oxen.htm
National Oregon/California Trail Center: Trail Basics: Horse-Mule-Oxen
http://www.oregontrailcenter.org/His...ulesOrOxen.htm
Each had it's advantages the Horse was the fastest but also the most expensive and it had other draw backs.
The Mule was cheaper & more sure footed than the Horse and Indian's were less likely to steal them so they as they prized the Horse.
I can remember hearing the story of a Prospector who had a Horse/Mule Team. He tried to get the team to move and only the horse would move so in desperation he built a fire under the Mule. Well that Mule pulled the wagon just far ahead until it was under the fire and the wagon/load including dynamite blew up.
Oxen were easier to manage,even cheaper than Mules, could carry more and were even less desirable to Indian's.
Oxen were also more valuable once the settlers reached their destination as a work animal on the farm making them the choice of most on the Oregon/California Trail...
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Old 20 Mar 17, 11:24
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Paul Bunyan & Babe Blue Ox: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_B...be_the_Blue_Ox

The first Oxen used in Minnesota were @ the North West Company's Fort Grand Portage.
In Canada Louis Hebert was the first European to Farm using Oxen.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Hebert
They were probably brought to Grand Portage, Minnesota & Fort William, Ontario after the French Regime but maybe before.
Oxen were used to pull carts containing furs/trade goods from Grand Portage to Fort Charlotte on the Pigeon River and back.
They were also used to help load and unload ships at dock the Oxen themselves would have arrived by Tall Ships the result of earlier stock from Quebec.
Few if any roads existed at this time in the rugged Canadian Shield that Grand Portage, Cook County, Minnesota/ Fort William, Ontario is a part of.
With limited tools, resources and time there were only little pockets of European humanity in the wilderness connected by trails and portages like Grand Portage.

Last edited by SmackUm; 20 Mar 17 at 14:18..
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Old 29 May 17, 09:12
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..seemed like people traveled ''far'' back then, considering the modes of transport--
..they had the time to do it, though--people had more patience back then...
..it states oxen ''15'' miles a day--now that would take 15 minutes
...what a big change in the American [ human ] spirit/culture/life/etc since then

Last edited by Moulin; 29 May 17 at 09:17..
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Old 29 May 17, 09:25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmackUm View Post
Ray Mears does a good job on Wild Historical Documents I've seen Wild France the European Beaver was almost trapped into extinction as was the American Beaver here.
Maybe the most important thing in the exploration of America was the question of transportation.
Horse-Mule-Oxen: http://oregonpioneers.com/oxen.htm
National Oregon/California Trail Center: Trail Basics: Horse-Mule-Oxen
http://www.oregontrailcenter.org/His...ulesOrOxen.htm
Each had it's advantages the Horse was the fastest but also the most expensive and it had other draw backs.
The Mule was cheaper & more sure footed than the Horse and Indian's were less likely to steal them so they as they prized the Horse.
I can remember hearing the story of a Prospector who had a Horse/Mule Team. He tried to get the team to move and only the horse would move so in desperation he built a fire under the Mule. Well that Mule pulled the wagon just far ahead until it was under the fire and the wagon/load including dynamite blew up.
Oxen were easier to manage,even cheaper than Mules, could carry more and were even less desirable to Indian's.
Oxen were also more valuable once the settlers reached their destination as a work animal on the farm making them the choice of most on the Oregon/California Trail...
There is a quote from a Confederate defender of Vicksburg (quoted in Chiltern's BBC programme on the Civil War in song) that the mule was much tastier eating than the horse - never seems to have caught on in France though. not heard of any mule meat shops.
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  #7  
Old 29 May 17, 10:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin View Post
..seemed like people traveled ''far'' back then, considering the modes of transport--
..they had the time to do it, though--people had more patience back then...
..it states oxen ''15'' miles a day--now that would take 15 minutes
...what a big change in the American [ human ] spirit/culture/life/etc since then
The British Army Field Service Regulations as updated to include the Indian Army in 1909 incorporates tables to be used when planning operations showing the rate of march that can be achieved by pack horses (ponies), mules, oxen and camels. And includes instructions on which should be used where and for what. Little distinction is made between mules and ponies but mules appear to be preferred as hardier. Pack oxen can only achieve just over half the speed of ponies or mules and camels are even slower. Mules can be loaded and unloaded much faster than camels or oxen. Four men can load 60 mules in an hour. Animal drawn transport is much slower than pack animals an ox drawn cart achieving only a quarter of the speed of pack mules (mule drawn transport is less than half the speed of pack animals).

The transport column should take a short rest after the first half hour of travel and regular breaks thereafter as circumstances dictate. A day's march is 15 miles under good conditions but may only be about 8 in poor going. A significant amount of time will be spent at the start and end of each march, loading and unloading animals, hitching and unhitching wagons, getting the column assembled etc. It is recommended that the slowest animals lead (presumably to avoid straggling). Time should be allowed to achieve all this in daylight so that in winter months marches may be shorter.

A day's break should be taken every seven days - not for the padre's benefit but for the secular viewpoint of resting animals and men.

I have significantly paraphrased. The regulations were based on many campaigns and much experience and I would imagine much the same constraints would have been present for the early Western pioneers
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  #8  
Old 30 May 17, 07:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin View Post
..seemed like people traveled ''far'' back then, considering the modes of transport--
..they had the time to do it, though--people had more patience back then...
..it states oxen ''15'' miles a day--now that would take 15 minutes
...what a big change in the American [ human ] spirit/culture/life/etc since then
Don't forget that a mounted man, possibly leading a pack horse could probably cover a great deal more distance in a day than a train of ox pulled wagons. However he probably couldn't sustain that pace day in day out
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