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Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Historical Events & Eras > Vietnam War

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Vietnam War The Battle for Vietnam. .

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  #31  
Old 05 Mar 17, 13:50
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Originally Posted by lirelou View Post
Why would you drop someone out of a Huey? Especially at a time in the war when no small number of US Army aviators were highly experience in all means of insertions?
I don't know why you would. As far as I can find, the 11th Pathfinder Company is the only unit that did. I suppose because the CO could?

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Oh, IIRC, the 5th SFG had 7 combat jumps it was counting when I left in 1969.
Thanks for that info. I didn't realize there were that many. Did DA consider them to be "combat" jumps? Did they count for the mustard stain? I'm curious because there were still quite a few 5th SFG Vietnam veterans walking around Ft. Bragg when I got there and the only combat jump wings I recall seeing were worn by a few men who made the Grenada jump with one of the ranger battalions.
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  #32  
Old 05 Mar 17, 20:54
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This is an interesting question to me because I have friend who claims to have made a combat jump in Vietnam. He served with the 101st and claimed to have been in the Rangers. I don't remember for sure when he was there but 1967 sticks in my mind. I was in the 82nd from '69 through '71 and I have read a lot about airborne operations and Vietnam and I have never read or heard anything that confirms his story.

I have never pressed him for more detail on this supposed jump because I don't want to call him a liar. I am still curious if his story might be true.

Yes, jump pay was $55 when I was in.
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  #33  
Old 08 Mar 17, 02:47
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The one leg guy's not the only one who's full of bs.
noun_Combat-battle,fight,hostilities,warfare,engagement,encoun ter,armed conflict,contest,clash.
Junction City was almost a three months long operation.
Straight leg grunts from the 1st,4th,25th,196th and 11ACR swept,secured and maintained the security of that drop zone weeks before a boot of the 173rd touched it.
My duster was part of the 25th element,we took our first kia on this operation.
By the time the 173rd jumped(22feb67)the drop zone was safe enough for civilian photographers and reporters to meet them on the ground.
During Junction City we seen every type vehicle,piece of equipment the U.S.Army owned,giant bulldozers,5ton trenching machines.
Wikipedia says Junction City was a Viet Cong strategic victory(they fled to Cambodia) but I know better.General Westmoreland choppered out to our fire base and told us the operation was a big setback for the enemy.In honor of the great job we did the general himself gave out medals and T-bone steaks,to most everyone.I missed out on the T-bones as some of us had to stay out on our duster for perimeter security while the generals choppers were on the ground.That kind of pissed me off,not getting a steak.Bet I could have blown his chopper out of the sky with the twin 40's I was sitting on ,I thought as he flew out of the fire base,with my steak.
My dad was 82nd airborne,he made all of their jumps during ww2.After the war he went back to milking cows in Minn. He always tucked his coveralls into his work boots after he got back home.
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  #34  
Old 08 Mar 17, 02:52
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  #35  
Old 31 Mar 17, 00:07
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Quote:
Thanks for that info. I didn't realize there were that many. Did DA consider them to be "combat" jumps? Did they count for the mustard stain? I'm curious because there were still quite a few 5th SFG Vietnam veterans walking around Ft. Bragg when I got there and the only combat jump wings I recall seeing were worn by a few men who made the Grenada jump with one of the ranger battalions.
DA did not. The rules for Vietnam combat jumps were the same as the rules for WWII combat jumps, i.e. the had to be part of a joint or combined operation. They were memorialized in a series of bronze plaques in the 5th SFG HQ in Nha Trang. Today, with the clout Special Forces has, they have been recognized, along with the MACVSOG jumps in Vietnam.

For the record, all the US combat drops, to include the Vietnam drops, do not equal the number of jumps made by the ARVN Airborne in both French and RVN service. I believe they had about 48. The French do not have 'combat' jumps per se, but "Operational" jumps. Same animal, but counting down to platoon level (Tho and Nung Parachute Platoons), not to mention the individual reinforcement jumps during the last days of DBP.
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  #36  
Old 07 May 17, 17:59
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Havent been in here in a while...Just seen where Ken Jensen passed sry to hear

I was 2/502nd Infantry 101st most of 1970....MOST of our units were in the Ashau Valley AO...... Not saying there were not any jumps made by others....but I never heard of any....lotta wannabees out there...and even seen some in VA hospitals.....since I'm on here and been down memory lane this week in Ashau....could any of you troops steer me to some good maps on Armchair site of FSB's in I- Corp region....mind has been in the FSB's Shock Veghel Maureen Ripcord Barnett area.....Hills 714..882...Comeback Ridge....operation Texas Star.....thx.....
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  #37  
Old 09 May 17, 10:43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hankwill View Post
The one leg guy's not the only one who's full of bs.
noun_Combat-battle,fight,hostilities,warfare,engagement,encoun ter,armed conflict,contest,clash.
Junction City was almost a three months long operation.
Straight leg grunts from the 1st,4th,25th,196th and 11ACR swept,secured and maintained the security of that drop zone weeks before a boot of the 173rd touched it.
My duster was part of the 25th element,we took our first kia on this operation.
By the time the 173rd jumped(22feb67)the drop zone was safe enough for civilian photographers and reporters to meet them on the ground.
During Junction City we seen every type vehicle,piece of equipment the U.S.Army owned,giant bulldozers,5ton trenching machines.
Wikipedia says Junction City was a Viet Cong strategic victory(they fled to Cambodia) but I know better.General Westmoreland choppered out to our fire base and told us the operation was a big setback for the enemy.In honor of the great job we did the general himself gave out medals and T-bone steaks,to most everyone.I missed out on the T-bones as some of us had to stay out on our duster for perimeter security while the generals choppers were on the ground.That kind of pissed me off,not getting a steak.Bet I could have blown his chopper out of the sky with the twin 40's I was sitting on ,I thought as he flew out of the fire base,with my steak.
My dad was 82nd airborne,he made all of their jumps during ww2.After the war he went back to milking cows in Minn. He always tucked his coveralls into his work boots after he got back home.
Where was yo buds, they wouldn't save you a mf'n steak...
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  #38  
Old 09 May 17, 10:58
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I never heard of a 101 jump in SE Asia. Knew a guy on jump status with the First Cav, but he was not a Pathfinder and I don't believe he ever claimed a combat jump. Special Forces had HALO qualified Recon teams that did a ton of jumps. Knew one guy that made over 100 in Vietnam, of course most of these were practice jumps.
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My worst jump story:
My 13th jump was on the 13th day of the month, aircraft number 013.
As recorded on my DA Form 1307 Individual Jump Log.
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  #39  
Old 09 May 17, 11:00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 101combatvet View Post
I never heard of a 101 jump in SE Asia. Knew a guy on jump status with the First Cav, but he was not a Pathfinder and I don't believe he ever claimed a combat jump. Special Forces had HALO qualified Recon teams that did a ton of jumps. Knew one guy that made over 100 in Vietnam, of course most of these were practice jumps.
I heard the 1st Cav had one brigade Airborne qualified when they deployed, but that was not sustained.
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  #40  
Old 09 May 17, 11:03
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
I heard the 1st Cav had one brigade Airborne qualified when they deployed, but that was not sustained.
Not sure, I was afraid to talk to him because he later worked for the CIA.
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  #41  
Old 09 May 17, 14:07
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
I heard the 1st Cav had one brigade Airborne qualified when they deployed, but that was not sustained.
In 1963, the Army formed it's first cavalry assault unit as a test unit, taken from the 11th Airborne Div, it was reclassified as the 11th Air Assault Div (test) (It was not the size of a full division) When the decision to send the airmobile unit to Vietnam was made, it was quickly brought up to division size by adding the Army's 2ID and reflagging it all as the First Cavalry Division. The original test group had all trained in the new concept and had been jump qualified before the test group was formed. But the bulk of the Division deployed to Vietnam in 1965 was dismounted Infantry. They were trained on the job in Vietnam in Airmobile SOP. You can read more about it by reading Gen, Hal Moore's "We were Soldiers Once, and Young" Moore commanded a battalion in the test group, which was reflagged as 1/7th Cavalry when the 1st Cavalry Division was formed.
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  #42  
Old 09 May 17, 19:31
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Originally Posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
I heard the 1st Cav had one brigade Airborne qualified when they deployed, but that was not sustained.
Yes, in the original, test structure of the air assault division, one brigade was on jump status. This was retained when the test division and elements of 2nd ID were reflagged as 1st Cavalry before deployment to Vietnam.

The jump status elements were 1st BDE HHC; 1st Battalion, 8th Cavalry; 2d Battalion, 8th Cavalry; and 1st Battalion, 12th Cavalry. 2d Battalion, 19th Field Artillery was also on jump status, to support the brigade.
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  #43  
Old 09 May 17, 19:35
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Originally Posted by 82redleg View Post
Yes, in the original, test structure of the air assault division, one brigade was on jump status. This was retained when the test division and elements of 2nd ID were reflagged as 1st Cavalry before deployment to Vietnam.

The jump status elements were 1st BDE HHC; 1st Battalion, 8th Cavalry; 2d Battalion, 8th Cavalry; and 1st Battalion, 12th Cavalry. 2d Battalion, 19th Field Artillery was also on jump status, to support the brigade.
Thanks, I'm glad I remembered it correctly.
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  #44  
Old 12 May 17, 09:00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 82redleg View Post
Yes, in the original, test structure of the air assault division, one brigade was on jump status. This was retained when the test division and elements of 2nd ID were reflagged as 1st Cavalry before deployment to Vietnam.

The jump status elements were 1st BDE HHC; 1st Battalion, 8th Cavalry; 2d Battalion, 8th Cavalry; and 1st Battalion, 12th Cavalry. 2d Battalion, 19th Field Artillery was also on jump status, to support the brigade.
My guy wore the 1st Cav patch with an Airborne tab as a combat patch. I never saw it worn that way before, when questioned about it he mumbled some **** that made no sense. No one questioned it any further.
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My worst jump story:
My 13th jump was on the 13th day of the month, aircraft number 013.
As recorded on my DA Form 1307 Individual Jump Log.
No lie.

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-2 Commando Jumpmaster
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  #45  
Old 12 May 17, 11:24
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101combatvet, If you were assigned to the 1st Bde, 1st Cav when it was on jump status, then you wear the Cav patch with the airborne tab over it. I saw at least a hundred cases between 1965-1989, though I don't remember any wearers who were legs. It's the same with the 101 Abn patch. If you serve a combat tour with the 101, which is no longer on jump status, you still wear the patch with the airborne tab. It is a part of the Division's history, and the 101st Airborne vets from WWII on want it kept with the patch. (ps, Not a 101st Abn vet, but attend a lot of their reunions here in south Florida. At this year's snowbird reunion there were three WWII vets, two who had served in the division, and one buddy who had served in the 11th Abn in the Philippines.)

In the case of the 1st Cav, having served in the 1st Bde when it returned from RVN, I can state with authority that the airborne tab is/was not considered a part of the 1st Cav patch unless you are/were in the Divisional Ranger company or LRSRs unit.
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