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American Age of Discovery, Colonization, Revolution, & Expansion Military history of North America. .

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  #1  
Old 16 Oct 16, 01:53
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Perm in Ontario

Hello everyone,
Can you provide me with any info about Perm, ON? According to wiki, it was found in 1830s.
I never knew of the very existence of any namesakes of my hometown.
A while ago, without any hostile intention, I was just looking for weather forecast on weather.yahoo.com - the only Perm they offered was this one. That's how I found out that not only Moscow, St. Petersburg and Odessa exist in the New World. Strange, for I was sure Perm is a somewhat rare name.
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  #2  
Old 16 Oct 16, 05:28
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There is also a geological period- the Permian Period- named after Perm in Russia by the British geologist, Sir Roderick Murchison.

Said to date from c.. 298 to 252 million years ago, it lay between the Carboniferous and the Triassic strata and is noted for indications that it culminated in a mass extinction of species on the planet Earth, " a biological dividing line that few animals crossed."- only 10% in the sea and 30% on land.

Whether this was caused by volcanic eruptions, an asteroid strike or less dramatic climate change, is not clear. It marked the end of the so-called 'Paleozoic Era' on our planet and the beginning of the Mezozoic.

The subsequent period of recovery of life, and another mass extinction, eventually saw the appearance of our friends the dinosaurs and little rodent mammals that were our own ancestors.
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Old 16 Oct 16, 06:49
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Most duplicates are due to home sick settlers naming their new place after where they came from (eg Boston) There were a lot of refugees from Russia settled in Canada in the 19th century. This principle applies in a lot of places but for example I'm not sure whether Melbourne in Australia is named after Lord Melbourne a British Prime Minister or the town of Melbourne in Derbyshire.

Places like Cairo and Memphis do puzzle me as I doubt that there was much of an influx of Egyptian settlers in the early colonies/USA

As well as the Finmark Station in Petrograd (where Lenin arrived) there was also a Finmark Station in Canada
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Old 16 Oct 16, 06:53
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Originally Posted by jf42 View Post
There is also a geological period- the Permian Period- named after Perm in Russia by the British geologist, Sir Roderick Murchison.

Said to date from c.. 298 to 252 million years ago, it lay between the Carboniferous and the Triassic strata and is noted for indications that it culminated in a mass extinction of species on the planet Earth, " a biological dividing line that few animals crossed."- only 10% in the sea and 30% on land.

Whether this was caused by volcanic eruptions, an asteroid strike or less dramatic climate change, is not clear. It marked the end of the so-called 'Paleozoic Era' on our planet and the beginning of the Mezozoic.

The subsequent period of recovery of life, and another mass extinction, eventually saw the appearance of our friends the dinosaurs and little rodent mammals that were our own ancestors.
Thank you. Of course I know about the Permian Period, as well as about Perm land - the vast territory with this name existed long before the city was found. IIRC, "Perm" is translated from Vepsian as "far away". And no relation to the hairstyle.

But I'd like to know about the namesake in Ontario.
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Old 16 Oct 16, 07:00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkV View Post
Most duplicates are due to home sick settlers naming their new place after where they came from (eg Boston) There were a lot of refugees from Russia settled in Canada in the 19th century. This principle applies in a lot of places but for example I'm not sure whether Melbourne in Australia is named after Lord Melbourne a British Prime Minister or the town of Melbourne in Derbyshire.

Places like Cairo and Memphis do puzzle me as I doubt that there was much of an influx of Egyptian settlers in the early colonies/USA

As well as the Finmark Station in Petrograd (where Lenin arrived) there was also a Finmark Station in Canada
Finmark station sounds in Russian "Finland station" - just pointing out the direction of its railway which was called Finland Rail Road at the time when the station was built. My guess "Finmark" is a Swedish translation. When Finland was a part of Russian Empire, Swedish geographical names were preferred to Finnish ones.
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Old 16 Oct 16, 07:12
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Originally Posted by MarkV View Post
Most duplicates are due to home sick settlers naming their new place after where they came from (eg Boston) There were a lot of refugees from Russia settled in Canada in the 19th century. This principle applies in a lot of places but for example I'm not sure whether Melbourne in Australia is named after Lord Melbourne a British Prime Minister or the town of Melbourne in Derbyshire.

Places like Cairo and Memphis do puzzle me as I doubt that there was much of an influx of Egyptian settlers in the early colonies/USA

As well as the Finmark Station in Petrograd (where Lenin arrived) there was also a Finmark Station in Canada
Then there is Athens and a host of towns with biblical names.
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Old 16 Oct 16, 07:17
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Then there is Athens and a host of towns with biblical names.
Mostly in the South, I guess
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Old 16 Oct 16, 07:18
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I found this. Doesn't give a reason for the choice of name though.

http://www.ghosttownpix.com/ontario/towns/perm.html
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Old 16 Oct 16, 07:24
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Mostly in the South, I guess
Good guess. There are some scattered throughout the country such as Bethlehem PA.

Here is a small list.

http://www.breakingisraelnews.com/37...R4kPRXG9X20.97
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Old 16 Oct 16, 07:47
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I found this. Doesn't give a reason for the choice of name though.

http://www.ghosttownpix.com/ontario/towns/perm.html
Thank you very much, Half Pint John!
It looks like the place is almost extinct by now. That's why I couldn't find much about it.
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Old 16 Oct 16, 10:21
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Good guess. There are some scattered throughout the country such as Bethlehem PA.
That area of northeastern Pennsylvania has quite a few biblical place names. There's also Nazareth, Galilee, Damascus and Mt Ararat, just off the top of my head.
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Old 16 Oct 16, 10:59
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I found this. Doesn't give a reason for the choice of name though.

http://www.ghosttownpix.com/ontario/towns/perm.html
There are apparently 3 Perm islands in the world. One is off the coast of Maryland, one off the coast of Yemen* and one off the coast of Ireland. It would seem likely that the Settlers of Perm Canada came from the last of these.

* Once known as Perim island
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Old 16 Oct 16, 13:38
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Oh my, ...

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Originally Posted by dmf01 View Post
Thank you very much, Half Pint John!
It looks like the place is almost extinct by now. That's why I couldn't find much about it.
... the Perm you refer to is in Mulmur Twp., in Dufferin County; I worked in Shelburne Detachment back in 1986-87, we policed all of Dufferin County. I drove through the area on almost a daily basis, locals may have referred to it, "Perm" may have appeared on a County map at the time but I can't say I remember it now.

I can tell you that Mulmur, and Mono Twp's are amongst the most scenic in the Prov. that don't abut on water. They sit on the northern extension of the Niagara Escarpment; treed rolling hills, large horse/mixed farms, trout creeks and ponds, affluent homes, and vacation properties. The area, like others settled post-War of 1812, was more British than American. The Queen Mum visited and stayed with friends in Mono back in the 80's.

The summary that John supplied applies to many small farming hamlets that grew through the 19th Century; a mill, church, houses, stores, a school, were built next to water or at a crossroads (Perm is at a nondescript crossroads). Over time, only a cemetery, perhaps a schoolhouse turned residence, a large stone/brick house or two, or church, and foundations remain; they're ubiquitous in rural Ontario. Most, like Perm don't even have a sign unless they're on a major road (vs. concession or side road), these former hamlets don't even rate to be called "Ghost Towns".

Incidentally, my wife and I purchased our first home, in a small community called Springwater Lakes near Whitfield (just a church and cemetery remain) in Mulmur, all of 6.6 km driving distance to the west of Perm; hey, we were Perm suburbanites!
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Old 16 Oct 16, 14:29
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Places like Cairo and Memphis do puzzle me as I doubt that there was much of an influx of Egyptian settlers in the early colonies/USA
I am guessing that might have to do with comparng the Missippi to the Nile
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Old 16 Oct 16, 16:32
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The summary that John supplied applies to many small farming hamlets that grew through the 19th Century; a mill, church, houses, stores, a school, were built next to water or at a crossroads (Perm is at a nondescript crossroads). Over time, only a cemetery, perhaps a schoolhouse turned residence, a large stone/brick house or two, or church, and foundations remain; they're ubiquitous in rural Ontario. Most, like Perm don't even have a sign unless they're on a major road (vs. concession or side road), these former hamlets don't even rate to be called "Ghost Towns".
Not unique to Canada - where I live the forge, shop and the mill are now private houses as is the vicarage and the school house. There are about 15 other houses and cottages round a couple of commons and some oast houses. Some have been converted to holiday lets. The church remains having been built in the 12th century. Yet in our case people have been living here since before the Romans came and the decline has been due to the increased productivity in agriculture which requires far fewer farmers let alone farm labourers. There has been an increase in stables both recreational riding and training race horses. Round here hacking is still something people do on horseback without a computer! Crime apart from the occasional theft of sheep or agricultural machinery is rare and AFAAK committed by people from far away

There are many places like this in the area
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