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  #16  
Old 02 Oct 04, 06:17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 17poundr
Sorry meant to press the 'edit',

anyway,

how about the navy's Aye, aye?

Where does the word Sir, come from?
(I know it has something to do with knighthood...)

A teaser,
do you know what the ww2 era brit military slang term 'Stonk' stands for???
IIRC it is being hit or hitting the enemy with Mortars. But as to when/where it originated and from what root word I don't know.
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  #17  
Old 02 Oct 04, 06:37
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Gallowglass

The word ''Gallowglass'' is the Gaelic for a ''Foreign Soldier'', from the Gaelic ''Gall'' ( Foreigner) and ''Oglach'' ( Warrior).

It was historically used to describe Scottish mercenaries who were brought over to Ireland by various Irish kings and chieftans from the 13th Century onwards. These Gallowglass were well armoured and carried large swords and were used to form tactically defensive positions around which the lightly Irish warriors could harry the Anglo/Norman Knights and men at arms.
They could also be used to punch a hole in the ranks of an opposing army by attacking with their great Swords, the ''Claymores''.

The Gallowglass eventually became part of the Irish military and cultural scene and were a factor in Irish warfare up until circa 1600.

See http://www.cisl.ie/mars/rory/gallowglass.htm

for some more info.
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  #18  
Old 02 Oct 04, 06:39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfe Tone
IIRC it is being hit or hitting the enemy with Mortars. But as to when/where it originated and from what root word I don't know.
Yep, but 'STONK' referred to a bombardment by any arty, infact the heavy's used it alot.

They had three different ways of shelling (be it 155mm or 3inch mortars), one was a 'light' which had a slang term too,
the second was lots of shells, on a larger area, this I believe was the 'stonk'.
And the third was a consentrated pattern on a specific point, and had the slang term for it too...
But in essence you got it right!
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  #19  
Old 02 Oct 04, 06:43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfe Tone
Gallowglass

The word ''Gallowglass'' is the Gaelic for a ''Foreign Soldier'', from the Gaelic ''Gall'' ( Foreigner) and ''Oglach'' ( Warrior).

It was historically used to describe Scottish mercenaries who were brought over to Ireland by various Irish kings and chieftans from the 13th Century onwards. These Gallowglass were well armoured and carried large swords and were used to form tactically defensive positions around which the lightly Irish warriors could harry the Anglo/Norman Knights and men at arms.
They could also be used to punch a hole in the ranks of an opposing army by attacking with their great Swords, the ''Claymores''.

The Gallowglass eventually became part of the Irish military and cultural scene and were a factor in Irish warfare up until circa 1600.

See http://www.cisl.ie/mars/rory/gallowglass.htm

for some more info.
Do you think the word for foreigners goes back to the era when the british isles had celtic tribes who did trade with the Gauls, of Gallia pre Romanic?
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  #20  
Old 02 Oct 04, 07:02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 17poundr
Do you think the word for foreigners goes back to the era when the british isles had celtic tribes who did trade with the Gauls, of Gallia pre Romanic?
Well I don't live in the British Isles so couldn't say for sure.

But there was certainly a number of different Celtic political entities spread throughout Britain and Ireland say circa 100 B.C.

I am sure there were links between them all that are now lost to us.

The Celts of Ireland were however of a different linguistic root to those of Britain. The Irish speak ''Q Celtic'' and the Welsh ''P Celtic'', so I presume the Celts of Britain spoke the same as them.

Anyway recent research indicates that while culturally both Britain and Ireland were Celtic in language and culture at the time of the Romans the racial origins of many of the inhabitants of these islands streches back much further to mesolithic and neolithic times.
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Old 02 Oct 04, 07:20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfe Tone
Well I don't live in the British Isles so couldn't say for sure.

But there was certainly a number of different Celtic political entities spread throughout Britain and Ireland say circa 100 B.C.

I am sure there were links between them all that are now lost to us.

The Celts of Ireland were however of a different linguistic root to those of Britain. The Irish speak ''Q Celtic'' and the Welsh ''P Celtic'', so I presume the Celts of Britain spoke the same as them.

Anyway recent research indicates that while culturally both Britain and Ireland were Celtic in language and culture at the time of the Romans the racial origins of many of the inhabitants of these islands streches back much further to mesolithic and neolithic times.
Yes, but the Gauls called them selves something like Gallia, which is the Roman version of the pronunciation, shurely the Irish celts who certainly were in contact with the Brittany and Normandy coasts for trade, would have called them by a similar word, and maybe thinking they were the only 'foreign' people they knew, the word gall, came from this???
Yes, the enigmatic Picts (who I dont believe just died off, more like were descimated but many just bred into the celtic peoples).
You do know that modern Scots came from Ireland dont you?
the originals (People like the southern Celts of modern England, Wales ect), only came after stonehenge, but were concuered by Irish celts who invaded.
Lets face it the celts and the Gaulls, who were just french celts.
Combined had a much larger community, and a sophisticated system of trade, and arts.
If they wouldnt have been so fragmented, and got it together, they would have crushed Rome, before it got too strong with ease, but they werent into this kind of thinking, more into tribal war...
But the enigmatic relics in scotland some 10 000 years old, merit discussion. For example they found stone objects that depicted the platonic solids from this era! Small things, like you get in classrooms today.
Also they have old castles, where the stone walls have been melted!
They tried a reconstruction, and managed to melt about a couple of cubic feet here and there with giant bonfires, nobody nows how they did it some five thousand years ago!
I have been in western Scotland and it is a special place, you can hop along the islands, very close to ireland!
Well you do have to sail a bit!
Still, you can see the same spiral motifs in the book of kells as in ten thousand year old pictish stone carvings!
Go figure...
The answer lies in Tir Na Nogh!
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Last edited by 17poundr; 02 Oct 04 at 07:25..
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  #22  
Old 02 Oct 04, 11:38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 17poundr
Yes, but the Gauls called them selves something like Gallia, which is the Roman version of the pronunciation, shurely the Irish celts who certainly were in contact with the Brittany and Normandy coasts for trade, would have called them by a similar word, and maybe thinking they were the only 'foreign' people they knew, the word gall, came from this???
Yes, the enigmatic Picts (who I dont believe just died off, more like were descimated but many just bred into the celtic peoples).
You do know that modern Scots came from Ireland dont you?
the originals (People like the southern Celts of modern England, Wales ect), only came after stonehenge, but were concuered by Irish celts who invaded.
Lets face it the celts and the Gaulls, who were just french celts.
Combined had a much larger community, and a sophisticated system of trade, and arts.
If they wouldnt have been so fragmented, and got it together, they would have crushed Rome, before it got too strong with ease, but they werent into this kind of thinking, more into tribal war...
But the enigmatic relics in scotland some 10 000 years old, merit discussion. For example they found stone objects that depicted the platonic solids from this era! Small things, like you get in classrooms today.
Also they have old castles, where the stone walls have been melted!
They tried a reconstruction, and managed to melt about a couple of cubic feet here and there with giant bonfires, nobody nows how they did it some five thousand years ago!
I have been in western Scotland and it is a special place, you can hop along the islands, very close to ireland!
Well you do have to sail a bit!
Still, you can see the same spiral motifs in the book of kells as in ten thousand year old pictish stone carvings!
Go figure...
The answer lies in Tir Na Nogh!
Since I am 1/4 Welsh any Celtic info is of interest to me. Perhaps a thread dedicated to more celtic topics?............
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  #23  
Old 02 Oct 04, 12:37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lance Williams
Since I am 1/4 Welsh any Celtic info is of interest to me. Perhaps a thread dedicated to more celtic topics?............
Sorry got completely carried away.
So, any answers to my original questions?

Does the word' Battalion', come from the medieval english formation of bowmen known as a 'battle?'...

how about the navy's Aye, aye?

Where does the word Sir, come from?
(I know it has something to do with knighthood...)

A teaser,
do you know what the ww2 era brit military slang term 'Stonk' stands for???

Anybody???
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Last edited by 17poundr; 02 Oct 04 at 12:42..
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  #24  
Old 02 Oct 04, 15:34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lance Williams
Since I am 1/4 Welsh any Celtic info is of interest to me. Perhaps a thread dedicated to more celtic topics?............
We must do that! Starting to get more interested in Ancient Irish History. The amazing thing there is so much information but getting in it the right order and allowing for the byast of the various old historians of the time obscures the record somewhat.

Perhaps tomorrow I will post something that I have written up earlier about Ancient Irish Warfare. If anyone wants to join in with what they know about the Celts or even other peoples who were around at the time who fought against them, like the Romans or later on the Vikings and the Picts all the bettter!
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  #25  
Old 02 Oct 04, 20:42
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Good idea, but can someone give at least one answer, I dont know męself, exept that 'stonk' was a Brit arty slang for a cerain kind of bombardment, but there were three of them, the pinpoint, the medium bombardment of a slightly larger area, and harassing fire on a large area, all had slang for them...
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  #26  
Old 03 Oct 04, 16:01
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfe Tone
We must do that! Starting to get more interested in Ancient Irish History. The amazing thing there is so much information but getting in it the right order and allowing for the byast of the various old historians of the time obscures the record somewhat.

Perhaps tomorrow I will post something that I have written up earlier about Ancient Irish Warfare. If anyone wants to join in with what they know about the Celts or even other peoples who were around at the time who fought against them, like the Romans or later on the Vikings and the Picts all the bettter!
I think I have a few books somewhere on the Celts/Vikings. If you get a thread started I'll dig up some info.
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Old 03 Oct 04, 16:23
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Back to the main point of this thread.....

-Catapult from the Greek Katapultos or "shield piercer", which was actually an inferior imitation of the ancient ....

-Onager or (onagrus) from the Latin for donkey (literally "wild ass"), so christened for its tendency to rear up its back end when fired. This evolved in the early medieval era into

-Mangonel (or "nag") from the Latin Manganon or "engine of war" was often referred to by its other nickname, the ........

-Gonne from which our modern word "gun"is derived.....at least according to one source......

Another source says that .....

-Gunnr and hildr in Icelandic meant "war and "battle", so the Scandinavian female name Gunnhildr was a favorite pet name for missile throwers in the Middle Ages. Such a devise was shortened to gunne and then gun.
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  #28  
Old 04 Oct 04, 17:02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lance Williams
I think I have a few books somewhere on the Celts/Vikings. If you get a thread started I'll dig up some info.
Well I have opened a thread at:

http://www.war-forums.com/forums/sho...150#post195150

In the Medieval Section of AGs ''Warfare through the Ages''.

Title: The Celts and Warfare

Anything relating to the Celts and their Enemies from earliest times up to say Culloden 1746 should be broad enough!

Wars, Battles, Arms of the Celts and their opponents gives plenty of scope for discussion.
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Old 04 Oct 04, 21:39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 17poundr
Sorry meant to press the 'edit',

anyway,

how about the navy's Aye, aye?

Where does the word Sir, come from?
(I know it has something to do with knighthood...)
The derivation of this is generally thought to be unknown, but some experts think it may possibly come from the German "Eiey!" - an exclamation of astonishment or admiration.
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Old 04 Oct 04, 21:42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfe Tone
Gallowglass

The word ''Gallowglass'' is the Gaelic for a ''Foreign Soldier'', from the Gaelic ''Gall'' ( Foreigner) and ''Oglach'' ( Warrior).
If I'm not mistaken, 'oglach' is more towards 'volunteer'. Then again, I have only a small knowledge of Gaelic.
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