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  #16  
Old 09 Sep 13, 09:56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Combat Engineer View Post
Well, it does not use 'steam'. Does not appear to have some kind of internet activation scheme. As long as it not a bug fest I'll give it a good try.
I HATE steam. I'll never knowingly buy another game affiliated with them.

I'm going to wait for post-sale reviews. This is a pretty ambitious project, and I don't want to get burned.

Or just have it be like Harpoon 4, I think it was, where the learning curve to play the game was only slightly shorter than the Surface Warfare Career Course....
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  #17  
Old 09 Sep 13, 10:34
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Right now this game and:

Flashpoint Campaigns: Red Storm



http://www.matrixgames.com/products/...gns:.Red.Storm


Besides Panther Games Campaign engine games, I've pretty much dropped out of the PC wargame genre, sticking to good old card board via VASSAL.
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  #18  
Old 09 Sep 13, 15:57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Combat Engineer View Post
My current feeling is to wait at least 2 weeks, most likely a month, then decide.
There are going to be plenty of reviews on this one. Waiting at least a couple of weeks is the wisest choice. You will be grateful you did so.
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  #19  
Old 09 Sep 13, 20:22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herman Hum View Post
There are going to be plenty of reviews on this one. Waiting at least a couple of weeks is the wisest choice. You will be grateful you did so.
I'm going to see how the reviews go too. I hope it's really good. Truly, we need some type of game that essentially combines modern air, naval, and ground operations on an operational level. Like smashing Harpoon, War in the Pacfic, and Time of Fury together into a "big bang" of wargaming. I'm probably dreaming. LOL. War in the Pacific is probably the closest thing, but wrong time period. Harpoon handles it's niche pretty well, but really has no land warfare component. Essentially, I'd like to able to run something like the Falklands Campaign in total.
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  #20  
Old 09 Sep 13, 21:43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Combat Engineer View Post
The question is do you hold off on a purchase for a week-month in order make a judgement or will you dive in anyway right from the beginning??? I'm still trying to answer that question.
Like a CWO4 said at his retirement party. "Never fly the "A" model. That's what test pilots get paid for."

I'll wait.
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  #21  
Old 16 Sep 13, 22:51
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Hi Guys,

First. Full disclosure. I am one of the developers of the game.

Here's some testimonials and AAR"s from our Beta folks:

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3392507

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3404912

This one's buried in a pricing string:

Quote:
markadmiral
Hello,

I have no suggestions on price. But I can tell you, serving as a beta tester, that this is the most accurate and flexible commercial simulation of air/naval modern warfare bar none - there is no comparison with any existing sims. I am amazed at its scope, from counter-terrorism operations all the way up to global thermonuclear warfare simulated with realism and painstaking attention to detail. Conflicts from the Korean War to modern issues such as the Senkakus, South China Sea, Strait of Hormuz, and Syria are all simulated or can be simulated with the tools provided. I was able to whip up simple scenarios with the editor quickly and easily -this game is a superb sandbox game as well.

As a beta tester, the one thing I can tell you is that the COMMAND Team is truly relentless in their work to make this the premier naval simulation - they are always responding to feedback and updating the game. It's the COMMAND team that has convinced me more than anything else that this game will be here to stay - they are the most responsive team I've seen.
The effort and attention to detail that has gone into this system are very impressive. As a retired naval officer, I can say that you will not find more detailed and realistic simulation modelling, at least in the public domain - I have looked long and hard and this game has no peers. I want the game to be a great success, not just because the team richly deserves it but because I want it to thrive so we can continue to play simulations that challenge our intelligence and decision-making skills into the future. This game is a downloadable Naval War College, and should be a must be for any amateur or professional student of modern naval or joint warfare - or any taxpaying citizen who wants to understand what he is paying for, for that matter.

MATRIX will figure out the price, but I can say that I have gotten more education and entertainment from this than any of the 50 other computer game I've played - so please give it a close look and don't base your decision solely on cost (unless its really cheap, of course). This game will be something special - built by a coalition of the willing.

Neo, you should take the RED PILL.....

All the best,

Mark
Thanks!
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  #22  
Old 17 Sep 13, 14:48
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It looks promising. I'll wait until the reviews are in though. One thing about games with this level of detail, a lot of times a player doesn't understand if something is actually not right because they are not experts on the subject matter. I always wait to see what people that really know about the various RL aspects of the game have to say. I don't want to learn/practice stuff that isn't correct.

Last edited by StellarRat; 17 Sep 13 at 15:23..
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  #23  
Old 27 Sep 13, 14:58
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I ended up buying this on release day. It was 80 bones, which is a pretty penny, but I'm impressed. There are some minor bugs I've run into, none anywhere near gamebreaking. I think there is some optimization that needs to be done to make it run smoother, its not bad, just some delay in the zoom and scrolling, but apparently they are fixing that - then again every game developer says that. The tutorials are really well done and actually teach you the UI and mechanics. I have also played through some of the less complex scenarios and had a lot of fun.

Right now I am playing a ridiculously complex scenario. I have been at it for four (4) hours and have played 1 second of time in the game - setting up the refueling tracks, ELINT tracks, AEW tracks, BARCAPs, etc. takes a while. If you like the genre and aren't turned off by the price I say go for it. I think they have done a good job.
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Old 27 Sep 13, 15:02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stryker 19K30 View Post
I ended up buying this on release day. It was 80 bones, which is a pretty penny, but I'm impressed. There are some minor bugs I've run into, none anywhere near gamebreaking. I think there is some optimization that needs to be done to make it run smoother, its not bad, just some delay in the zoom and scrolling, but apparently they are fixing that - then again every game developer says that. The tutorials are really well done and actually teach you the UI and mechanics. I have also played through some of the less complex scenarios and had a lot of fun.

Right now I am playing a ridiculously complex scenario. I have been at it for four (4) hours and have played 1 second of time in the game - setting up the refueling tracks, ELINT tracks, AEW tracks, BARCAPs, etc. takes a while. If you like the genre and aren't turned off by the price I say go for it. I think they have done a good job.
Four hours to set it up!?!?!?!

OK, I've done that, but man....how big is the scenario?

Is it jus scenario-based, or is there a campaign option.

How big of engagements are practiable?
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  #25  
Old 27 Sep 13, 15:24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stryker 19K30 View Post
I ended up buying this on release day. It was 80 bones, which is a pretty penny, but I'm impressed. There are some minor bugs I've run into, none anywhere near gamebreaking. I think there is some optimization that needs to be done to make it run smoother, its not bad, just some delay in the zoom and scrolling, but apparently they are fixing that - then again every game developer says that. The tutorials are really well done and actually teach you the UI and mechanics. I have also played through some of the less complex scenarios and had a lot of fun.

Right now I am playing a ridiculously complex scenario. I have been at it for four (4) hours and have played 1 second of time in the game - setting up the refueling tracks, ELINT tracks, AEW tracks, BARCAPs, etc. takes a while. If you like the genre and aren't turned off by the price I say go for it. I think they have done a good job.
I did the same thing.... and I'm happy I did. Played the Toot's and some of the small scenarios. Very enjoyable.
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  #26  
Old 27 Sep 13, 15:40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
Four hours to set it up!?!?!?!

OK, I've done that, but man....how big is the scenario?

Is it jus scenario-based, or is there a campaign option.

How big of engagements are practiable?
Well, it is scenario based, but the scenario is basically a campaign. It is 48 hours of "time" but you have to do everything, nothing is notional. You need to set up the entire operation.

This particular one I am talking about:

Quote:
United States vs. Pakistani Belligerents



Date/Time: 2nd July 2014 / 12:00:00 Zulu

Location: Persian Gulf

Playable Side: United States



Background:

There is nothing more frightening to U.S. military planners than nuclear weapons falling into the wrong hands. Unfortunately the most likely places this could happen also present significant political and military challenges. That being so the US must be agile and decisive when using its military power to prevent what could be a horrifying opening to a Third World War.

In mid 2014 a Pakistani Army Brigadier with extremist ties has managed to convince his command to seize a Pakistani nuclear weapons site demanding that all US forces leave the region and Kashmiri territories be returned to their rightful owners or “God’s fury” will be unleashed upon Indian and US forces in the region. The United States cannot stand for this and must act. Due to current commitments the US does have significant assets in the region however they must be used well to succeed as Pakistan is a significant military power and an ally.

Good Luck!

Notes:

Aircraft marked as reserved are meant for players to arm them. Part of the game of the scenario is making wise munitions choices.

There are random events in the scenario. Please look in the mission editor's event engine if you wish to know what they are.
Quote:
Orders for Cmdr US Forces

Situation

Thirty six hours ago Pakistani forces went on high alert and several hours later intelligence assets indicated that heavy fighting was underway close to a key Air Force base and nuclear storage site in the northern Pakistan. Information from the Pakistani government, ISI and Army was panic ridden and confusing at best giving no clear idea of what was going on other than that local forces were fairing badly and supporting forces were not moving fast enough. By day break all cable news networks had received a recording of a lone Pakistani Brigadier demanding that Indian forces leave Kashmir and that US forces leave southwest Asian entirely or be swept away by “God’s Fury.” His point was driven home by very clear video of a captured Minhas Air Base, a nuclear weapon site and several armed ballistic missile launchers. The Pakistani government responded by issuing a statement that this is an internal problem and that it would consider any external interference an act of war. The United States is now facing its worst nightmare. A hostile nuclear non-state actor operating within the borders of distant ally.

Enemy Forces

Pakistani Belligerents: Command believes that belligerent forces are composed of elements of the 12th Independent Armored Brigade which are likely in defensive positions in and around Minhas Air Base. Although the force is mostly land based their order of battle does include air defence equipment and any abandoned equipment at the air base. Possible threats include Crotale air defence system, more portable MANPAD missile systems and 35mm AAA guns. There is no indication that any elements of the Pakistani Air Force are collaborating with these forces at all.

Regional Forces:

Pakistan: All Pakistani forces are on high alert and are likely hostile to any known or unknown aircraft approaching their territorial boundaries.

Command has detected significant activity from all Pakistani air defence zones including regular combat air patrol flights and active SPADA/Aspide and SA-3 SAM missile sites. The Pakistani Navy does have SAM equipped warships at sea as well. All indications are that they are prepared to defend their air space.

The active Air Order of battle is as follows:

ADZ North:

PAF Murid: F-7MP Skybolt fighters
PAF Peshawar: JF-17 Thunder fighters
PAF Chaklala: Saab 2000 Erieye AEW

ADZ Central:

PAF Mianwali: F-7MP Skybolt fighters
PAF Mushaf: F-16 AM fighters
PAF Rafiqui: F-7MP Skybolt fighters

ADZ West:

PAF Samungli: F-7P Airguard fighters

ADZ South:

PAF Faisal: ZKD-03 Karakoram Eagle AEW
PAF Masroor: Mirage IIIO fighters


PAF Shabaz: F-16C Blk 52 Falcon fighters

Iran: No official statements have been issue from Tehran. Iranian forces have gone on alert and are arrayed to defend their aerospace.



Command has detected increased readiness at Iranian air bases and air defence sites. All indications are that they are in a defensive posture. Active SAM and radar sites are available on your tactical map. Iranian fighter dispositions are as follows:


Mashad IAP/TAB 14: F-5E Tiger II fighters.

Busheur AB/TAB 6: F-4E Phantom II fighters

Dezful AB/TAB 4: F-5E Tiger II fighters

Tabriz AB/TAB 13 Mig-29 Fulcrum A fighters

Mehrabad IAP/TAB 1: Mig-29 Fulcrum A fighters

Hamedan AB/TAB 3: F-4E Phantom II fighters

Khatami AB/TAB 8: F-14A Tomcat fighters

Bandar Abbas IAP/TAB 9: F-4D Phantom II fighters

Omidyeh AB/TAB 5: F-7M Airguard fighters


India: Indian forces are mobilizing are on high alert. India has stated that it will not be threatened by Pakistan.



Command has detected increased readiness at Indian air bases and air defense sites. All indications are that they are in a defensive posture. Nuclear readiness has increased.


Jamnagar AFS: Mig-29 Fulcrum A fighters

Sirsa AFS: Mig21bis Fishbed N fighters

Adampur AFS: Mig-29 Fulcrum A fighters

Halwara AFS: Su-30MKI Flanker C fighters

Task Organization

Ali Al Salem Air Base: 12 F/A-18D Hornets



Al-Udeid Air Base: 2 RC-135W Rivet Joints, 2 RC-135V Rivet Joint, 10 KC-135R Stratotankers



Al Dhafra Air Base: 8 KC-135R Stratotankers, 12 F-22A Raptor, 2 RQ-4B Global Hawk Block 30, 3 E-3C Sentries, 2 U-2S



Bagram Air Base: 3 MQ-9B Reapesr, 14 F-16C Blk 40 Falcons, 6 EA-6B Prowler ICAP III, 8 A-10C Thunderbolt II



Diego Garcia: 6 KC-10A Extender, 8 B-52H Stratofortress, 2 B-2A Blk 30



Djibouti-Ambouli IAP/Camp Lemonier: 4 RQ-1B Predator, 8 F-15E Strike Eagle



Kandahar Airfield: 1 RQ-170A Sentinel UAV, 6 AV-8B Harrier II Plus



Masirah Air Base: 6 P-3C Orion Update III AIP



Thumrait Air Base: 10 KC-10A Extender



RAF Akrotiri: 2 RQ-4B Global Hawk Blk 30



USS Ohio

USS Hawaii

USS Jimmy Carter

USS Halsey

USS Winston S. Churchill

USS Hopper



Mission



You are to identify and destroy the nuclear storage bunker and any deployed TEL vehicles at PAF Minhas within 2 days.

Execution

At command discretion and by all means necessary. If you do end up violating a neutrals air space or in confrontation with Pakistani regulars or a bordering state you must still meet your primary objectives.



Command & Signal




Command: Al Dhafra AB

Signal: EMCON State C, unrestricted emissions
This has all kinda stuff going on, striking targets in Pakistan without Pakistani permission, Indians and Iranians possibly getting involved, you have to keep tabs on the Pakistanis (both Navy and Air Force), Indians, and Iranians all to destroy nuclear weapons in the hands of Islamic militants. Setting up the support packages and planning ingress/egress, deception, and scheduling of rotating AWACS and Tanker aircraft with their escorts is just mindbogglingly. Oh and you have to deal with arming/briefing/maintenance times.

As for the size of engagements it just depends on your computing speed how big they can be. Theoretically you could set up a global war in multiple theaters. This scenario has units on Cyprus all the way to Diego Garcia.
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  #27  
Old 27 Sep 13, 15:43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Combat Engineer View Post
I did the same thing.... and I'm happy I did. Played the Toot's and some of the small scenarios. Very enjoyable.
Those Norwegian patrol boat scenarios are a blast. Fast paced and action packed, especially the 1970s one with first gen missiles.
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  #28  
Old 27 Sep 13, 15:46
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Wow.

Excellent response.

I'm thinking this one may well be out of my depth.
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  #29  
Old 27 Sep 13, 15:50
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Stryker 19K30 has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] Stryker 19K30 has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] Stryker 19K30 has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] Stryker 19K30 has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] Stryker 19K30 has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] Stryker 19K30 has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] Stryker 19K30 has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] Stryker 19K30 has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] Stryker 19K30 has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] Stryker 19K30 has set a fine example for others to follow [1000] Stryker 19K30 has set a fine example for others to follow [1000]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
Wow.

Excellent response.

I'm thinking this one may well be out of my depth.
Well, you can work your way up to the super complex ones, there are also plenty of much less complex scenarios that come stock. There is a complexity rating that I have found to be actually truthful. Its also nice that when you set up your air missions, you can actually trust the missions to go off as planned and don't have to micromanage too much.
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Old 27 Sep 13, 15:52
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Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+]
Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+] Arnold J Rimmer has achieved enlightenment [1200+]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stryker 19K30 View Post
Well, you can work your way up to the super complex ones, there are also plenty of much less complex scenarios that come stock. There is a complexity rating that I have found to be actually truthful. Its also nice that when you set up your air missions, you can actually trust the missions to go off as planned and don't have to micromanage too much.

True. Still, I think I'm going to have to give this one a lot of thought.

Thanks for the input-hearing this from guys wih no axe to grind is a real help.
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