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Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Current Events > Europe

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Europe Issues of modern Europe. .

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  #241  
Old 03 Jul 14, 17:18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruitt View Post
With all due respect, if you say I am lying, as opposed to simply being wrong, prove it. Many European countries have tried hard to ignore their ties with Nazi Germany during the war. If the Nazis are mentioned at all the same countries stress how they fought the Nazi occupation as Partisans or used 'civil disobedience'. The Swedes did have a men in the Viking SS Division, like the Danes and Norwegians.

Pruitt
Start a thread — or find one of the old ones about this — and I might tell you what I know of that matter.

But no policy allowing Swedish citzens to join existed, not even some kind of tacit "understanding". It was simply outright illegal to do so, and the numbers bear out that it was uncommon, and something only the truly dedicated — whether to Nazism, anti-Bolshevism, or just war itself — did.
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  #242  
Old 03 Jul 14, 17:30
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Johan Banér Johan Banér is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Konzev View Post
Off BLOODY COURSE Sweden was massively economically integrated with the German economy. After the German take-over of Denmark and Norway it was hemmed in, and there was only one place Sweden could get coal from — Germany. No coal, and the entire Swedish inustry would simply shut down. That's would mean the loss of the bulk of the nations GDP, inidvidual citzen income, and a very short route to mass-umemployment, and general starvation. Trading with Germany to the near exclusion of everyone else was a matter of lack of choice, never of preference. It kept trading illicitly with the UK, except for pretty obvious reasons at a much restricted volume — what could be smuggled essentially.

People apparently either can't read a map, or have no grasp of how industrial economies operate, or possibly both.
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  #243  
Old 03 Jul 14, 17:54
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Pruitt Pruitt is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johan Banér View Post
Start a thread — or find one of the old ones about this — and I might tell you what I know of that matter.

But no policy allowing Swedish citzens to join existed, not even some kind of tacit "understanding". It was simply outright illegal to do so, and the numbers bear out that it was uncommon, and something only the truly dedicated — whether to Nazism, anti-Bolshevism, or just war itself — did.
Swedes served in the 5th SS Panzer Division Wiking, 11th SS Freiwillgen Panzer Grenadier Division Nordland, and 23rd SS Freiwillgen Panzer Grenadier Division Nederland. The 4th Platoon of the 3rd Company of the Armored Recon Battalion of Nordland was called Swedenzug. The Nordland Division fought to the end in Berlin.

[url]www.waffen-ssno[url]

The numbers might be "small" to some but Sweden let them go. The German embassy smuggled them to Germany.

Pruitt
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  #244  
Old 03 Jul 14, 18:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johan Banér View Post
Off BLOODY COURSE Sweden was massively economically integrated with the German economy. After the German take-over of Denmark and Norway it was hemmed in, and there was only one place Sweden could get coal from — Germany. No coal, and the entire Swedish inustry would simply shut down. That's would mean the loss of the bulk of the nations GDP, inidvidual citzen income, and a very short route to mass-umemployment, and general starvation. Trading with Germany to the near exclusion of everyone else was a matter of lack of choice, never of preference. It kept trading illicitly with the UK, except for pretty obvious reasons at a much restricted volume — what could be smuggled essentially.

People apparently either can't read a map, or have no grasp of how industrial economies operate, or possibly both.
Attitude is the key to this situation, and the attitude was broad sympathy towards the Third Reich:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_Germanic_Reich

http://www.historia.su.se/polopoly_f...nazism_eng.pdf
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  #245  
Old 03 Jul 14, 20:18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShAA View Post
As I've said, Russia has the right to ensure its security by whatever means possible.
Even if it means violating another country's sovereignty ?

If yes, then any other country can ensure it's own security by violating anybody else's sovereignty. I thought our Russian "friends" like to believe they are democratic, not anarchist.



Quote:
For a while you agree to one's outrageous actions or condone them in order not to antagonise him too much, thinking you can still work with this person. But at some point of time you draw a line in the sand, saying "enough is enough".
You saying Russia is chicken s**t ?


Quote:
Oh come on, you know them and they've been mentioned here many times as victims of NATO aggression. Stop fooling around.

That wasn't what you said.
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  #246  
Old 03 Jul 14, 20:24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShAA View Post
Every country is responsible for its own security, and if the neighbours act in the fashion which makes Russia's geopolitical position more vulnerable, Russia must act accordingly.
What ?
You've never heard of defensive alliances ?

You really must read more.


Quote:
No, I said that what's good for the goose, is equally good for the gander. If these countries and their affiliated structures use military force to achieve their foreign policy objectives, Russia must not be an exception.
So who used military force against the USS.......Russia before it moved on Crimea ?



Quote:
Of course, it's purely their business. Like it's one's business to tease a bear in the wilderness or stick wet fingers in a power plug. As for the "baseless", you can repeat it a 100 times more, but it won't become more true.
It's difficult to make the true any truer than it already is.
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  #247  
Old 03 Jul 14, 20:27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShAA View Post
NATO didn't suffer 1/100th of what the Germans had after Versailles, so please spare me the exaggeration of NATO's demilitarisation.

Irrelevant
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  #248  
Old 03 Jul 14, 23:48
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Originally Posted by tigersqn View Post
Irrelevant
Have you risen to the rank of moderator ?
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  #249  
Old 04 Jul 14, 00:22
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Originally Posted by ShAA View Post
It was assumed that in the spirit of peace, cooperation and disarmament NATO would become increasingly irrelevant and get disbanded.

NATO didn't suffer 1/100th of what the Germans had after Versailles, so please spare me the exaggeration of NATO's demilitarization.
First off, the NATO countries did cut back their military forces. Compare the size of the US Army in Germany in the bad old days. They may get cut again. If I was you I would find out who said that NATO would disband and kick him in the genitals. You have my permission!

Second, NATO has not lost a war so why should the suffer?

Pruitt
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  #250  
Old 04 Jul 14, 04:51
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Reposting this from ShAA's post, as some may have missed it, I did at first,

It's interesting,

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...-a-663315.html

German unification seems to be a gift that just keeps on giving, the EURO is one of it's bastard children as well
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  #251  
Old 04 Jul 14, 19:01
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Have you risen to the rank of moderator ?

Nope.
Former moderator 2002-2004
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  #252  
Old 04 Jul 14, 19:56
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Nope.
Former moderator 2002-2004
Who kicked you out ?
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  #253  
Old 04 Jul 14, 20:03
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Who kicked you out ?
Nobody........left of my own accord for personal reasons.
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