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  #16  
Old 22 Jan 13, 01:43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
Turning them into slightly better Reknowns really doesn't accomplish much....
Well, it was only one of them, Scharnhost was never brought back for the job.
RAF Bombers blew the other one's bows off on night, and that was the end of that.

6 x 15" guns instead of 9 x 11" was a reasonable conversion because the Germans had nothing in between. One less gun per turret would give you less of a top-weight problem, and it would have been able to hit back at BBs that were now nearly as fast.

"Ugly" sisters? First time I ever heard them called that...
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  #17  
Old 22 Jan 13, 02:28
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Originally Posted by The Exorcist View Post
Well, it was only one of them, Scharnhost was never brought back for the job.
RAF Bombers blew the other one's bows off on night, and that was the end of that.

6 x 15" guns instead of 9 x 11" was a reasonable conversion because the Germans had nothing in between. One less gun per turret would give you less of a top-weight problem, and it would have been able to hit back at BBs that were now nearly as fast.

"Ugly" sisters? First time I ever heard them called that...
Given Gneisnau's earlier problems of being a "wet ship", the addition of twin 15" turrets up forward would have only made her all the wetter. The Germans tried to make improvements on the ocean sailing capabilities of their light cruisers before the war, by elongating the length of their hulls, but were unsuccesful
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  #18  
Old 22 Jan 13, 03:05
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Originally Posted by Salinator View Post
Ageed. IIRC, the triple 11' turrets were leftovers and incorporated into the construction to reduce build time. The lack of freeboard was due to German design experience that even after the first conversion to the "Atlantic" clipper bow, forced them to increase the angle and flair after both ships suffered damage.
Seem to remember that the reason they did not build ships to take the larger guns was because in the first place they had a limit placed upon them following the first WW. lcm1
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  #19  
Old 22 Jan 13, 14:34
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Originally Posted by Salinator View Post
Ageed. IIRC, the triple 11' turrets were leftovers and incorporated into the construction to reduce build time. The lack of freeboard was due to German design experience that even after the first conversion to the "Atlantic" clipper bow, forced them to increase the angle and flair after both ships suffered damage.
The Gneisnau's 11-inch gun turrets and gun directors were removed and mounted in Norway as coastal artillery. One turret is still in existance today.
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Old 22 Jan 13, 15:10
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Originally Posted by johnbryan View Post
The Gneisnau's 11-inch gun turrets and gun directors were removed and mounted in Norway as coastal artillery. One turret is still in existance today.
Yep. And another was sent up their too, Bruno I think, but it was scapped in the 70's. The smaller 15cm guns, were put to good use as coastal units as well, in Denmark and some of the AA guns were put into the Atlantic Wall defensive works. Anything of value was stripped out of it and put to use.
In the end is was sank as a blockship.
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  #21  
Old 23 Jan 13, 23:01
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Originally Posted by lcm1 View Post
Seem to remember that the reason they did not build ships to take the larger guns was because in the first place they had a limit placed upon them following the first WW. lcm1
Going with bigger guns might have gotten them into an arms race that the KM had no chance of winning. The Strasbourgs had 13" guns in answer to the Deutschlands, no telling what launching their BCs with 15" guns might have started with the RN.

These ships entered service pre-war.
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Old 23 Jan 13, 23:07
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Exorcist View Post
Going with bigger guns might have gotten them into an arms race that the KM had no chance of winning. The Strasbourgs had 13" guns in answer to the Deutschlands, no telling what launching their BCs with 15" guns might have started with the RN.

These ships entered service pre-war.
Ah yes,that possibility slipped my mind.THAT was when we had a navy!! lcm1
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Old 25 Jan 13, 07:21
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Actually I find nothing wrong with 9x11" layout.

With such armament it could successfully combat anything except battleship, which could outrun.
Given that their main task would be convoy raiding, it is not disadvantage - it looks more as advantage.
Of course, it was not match for fast battleships (even with 15" guns), but they were constructed later.
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