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Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Current Events > Africa

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Africa Issues of modern Africa.

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  #1  
Old 27 Dec 13, 09:04
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CAR violence

"Dozens of people have been killed, including six peacekeepers from Chad, in the latest violence in the Central African Republic, officials say."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-25524729


"Assailants armed with heavy weapons were repelled after attacking the presidential palace and the residence of the Central African Republic's embattled leader late on Thursday, officials said."

http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...dential-palace
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  #2  
Old 29 Dec 13, 18:36
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Chad, The Sudan, Darfur, the Congo, Kenya! What is going on! Is it tribal warfare? Are we sure that Africa is better off now that the old European colonialists have been removed?

Were African nations better ruled and saver places when they were being colonized? How can we think otherwise?
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  #3  
Old 29 Dec 13, 18:52
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Originally Posted by majormack View Post
Were African nations better ruled and saver places when they were being colonized? How can we think otherwise?
Specific to the nation in this thread; no it wasn't better off and it wasn't safer.
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Old 29 Dec 13, 19:14
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_African_Republic


http://www.yale.edu/gsp/colonial/belgian_congo/

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  #5  
Old 29 Dec 13, 19:23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nichols View Post
Specific to the nation in this thread; no it wasn't better off and it wasn't safer.
I was referring to the entire continent of course and I didn't even mention some other troubled nations...Ruwanda?

If we measure the success or failure of a nation by the chaos therein, then I wonder if these same nations were less chaotic when they were being colonized, that's all.

It is a big question. I guess I could take one nation at a time and study its past, present and future, but it'd be more effort than I want to expend.

When TR, the Johnsons and even Hemingway trekked to African nations to hunt I suspect that they were more safe than they'd be today and didn't give their personal safety a second thought.

Do I support releasing nations from colonial to self rule? Yes, but only if it works. If that newly freed nation sinks into chaos, mass murder and starvation then I think giving them their freedom was a mistake.
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  #6  
Old 29 Dec 13, 19:45
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do you have any input on your links?
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  #7  
Old 29 Dec 13, 19:48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by majormack View Post
I was referring to the entire continent of course and I didn't even mention some other troubled nations...Ruwanda?
That's why I posted specific to the nation in this thread; the Central African Republic wasn't better off or safer.
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  #8  
Old 29 Dec 13, 20:03
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Originally Posted by Nichols View Post
do you have any input on your links?

What's the point? Those who're interested on the history of the CAR will read them. We know that those who want to wallow in ignorance won't. African Colonialism was a tale of woe and misery for the natives.
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Old 29 Dec 13, 20:26
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Originally Posted by Bwaha View Post
What's the point? Those who're interested on the history of the CAR will read them. We know that those who want to wallow in ignorance won't. African Colonialism was a tale of woe and misery for the natives.
Specific to the CAR, the colonial games continued past 1958. The French backed Dacko....Dacko arrested Goumba and established a one party state.

The French liked Bokassa until they carried out a coup and reinstated Dacko. Kolingba came in favor....Dacko had another coup....

Elections in 93.......Kolingba lost...freed all prisoners they day before he left office.

Patasse tried playing the fall of the Berlin Wall....the French devalued the CFA......the citizens lost half of their life savings with that one stroke of the pen.

Throughout this time there were French enclaves that weren't touch but out in the bush or 2 blocks from the legion's base.....it was open season on everyone.

Except the Americans.....everyone thought we were heavily armed and had thousands of rounds of ammo.....
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Old 30 Dec 13, 02:46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by majormack View Post
I was referring to the entire continent of course and I didn't even mention some other troubled nations...Ruwanda?

If we measure the success or failure of a nation by the chaos therein, then I wonder if these same nations were less chaotic when they were being colonized, that's all.

It is a big question. I guess I could take one nation at a time and study its past, present and future, but it'd be more effort than I want to expend.

When TR, the Johnsons and even Hemingway trekked to African nations to hunt I suspect that they were more safe than they'd be today and didn't give their personal safety a second thought.

Do I support releasing nations from colonial to self rule? Yes, but only if it works. If that newly freed nation sinks into chaos, mass murder and starvation then I think giving them their freedom was a mistake.
You can thank the bellguims for rawanda and burrindie.

Most african countries are prety stabel. Poor and backwards but stabel.
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Old 30 Dec 13, 02:51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by majormack View Post
Chad, The Sudan, Darfur, the Congo, Kenya! What is going on! Is it tribal warfare? Are we sure that Africa is better off now that the old European colonialists have been removed?

Were African nations better ruled and saver places when they were being colonized? How can we think otherwise?
Chad has being deal with there problem and has it under control. You mean sout sudan. Black people have it better of in the DRC now than when under white rull. The death rate is far lower. Kenya got attacked by a forghin terrorist group much like the USA was.

Each region has it's own resoane for being all messed up.
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Old 30 Dec 13, 04:08
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Andrew. mack is a person who think the blacks can't control themselves. He thinks that the slaves prospered in America. Really. He's that screwed in the head...
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Old 30 Dec 13, 04:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by majormack View Post
I was referring to the entire continent of course and I didn't even mention some other troubled nations...Ruwanda?

If we measure the success or failure of a nation by the chaos therein, then I wonder if these same nations were less chaotic when they were being colonized, that's all.

It is a big question. I guess I could take one nation at a time and study its past, present and future, but it'd be more effort than I want to expend.

When TR, the Johnsons and even Hemingway trekked to African nations to hunt I suspect that they were more safe than they'd be today and didn't give their personal safety a second thought.

Do I support releasing nations from colonial to self rule? Yes, but only if it works. If that newly freed nation sinks into chaos, mass murder and starvation then I think giving them their freedom was a mistake.
So in essence you want to judge an entire continent based on your assumptions of race rather than any knowledge of its past or present? That makes sense.

Any thoughts on how the various indigenous empires and kingdoms did compared to European or Arab colonial forces? Any thoughts on the boundaries drawn up without thought or concern for nations within the nation? Or perhaps the sponsoring of dictators and guerrilla movements for decades after 'independence' during the Cold War and its effect on stability? the role of the Chinese? How does post-colonial Africa compare to precolonial Africa in terms of stability and violence? In fact any thoughts at all bar when you can pick up your white sheets from the cleaners?

A more nuanced understanding would suggest a number of factors - ranging from internal, external and encompassing everyone from Africans to those from outside.
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Old 31 Dec 13, 12:46
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http://www.sabreakingnews.co.za/2013...olence-in-car/

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Bangui – Fighting, lynchings and violent attacks remain a daily occurrence despite the presence of armed forces in Central African Republic’s (CAR) capital, Bangui, said the international medical organisation, MSF, in a statement on Tuesday.

“People are coming in with machete wounds to the head, hands and arms – injuries sustained as they tried to defend themselves,” said MSF’s emergency coordinator in Bangui, Laurent Sury.

“We’ve also seen people who have been stabbed … and people who have been either tortured or brutally beaten. We have even had a case of impalement. For the most part, these are young men,” he added.

Fighting has increased in the capital since a Seleka alliance colonel was lynched last week.
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Old 03 Jan 14, 13:24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by majormack View Post
If we measure the success or failure of a nation by the chaos therein, then I wonder if these same nations were less chaotic when they were being colonized, that's all.

It is a big question. I guess I could take one nation at a time and study its past, present and future, but it'd be more effort than I want to expend.
So you want to pass a judgement but you don't want to waste your time sitting through the hearings and listening to the witnesses.


Quote:
Do I support releasing nations from colonial to self rule? Yes, but only if it works. If that newly freed nation sinks into chaos, mass murder and starvation then I think giving them their freedom was a mistake.
There's civil war in the Central African Republic. That's chaos. By this standard, of course, in 1863 the British should have concluded that giving the USA their self rule had been a mistake, and that they had been better off when they were wisely ruled from London.
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