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  #31  
Old 10 Oct 17, 10:48
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Originally Posted by Surrey View Post
The French Charlemagne division was very committed helping defend the Fehrer bunker in Berlin.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/33rd...ne_(1st_French)
Yes, but most of the French volunteers had come forward really as such, freely. The two dozens or so British traitors were all from POW camps, and the Germans were, understandably, less than sure about such motives.

Naturally, some of their Russian units also contained ex-POWs, but there's a numbers issue. If you have thousands of volunteers, you can hardly decide they're all only motivated by a wish to leave the camp, and you can hardly afford not to use them at least as second-line troops; you can also make up full battalions of those.

On the contrary, as said the Brits were maybe two dozens. You can't make even a platoon; the fact that they are so few out of the prisoner population seems to imply they are an aberration; and you can very well afford not to use them for practical purposes, actually you are better served if you use them only for propaganda.

Martin Windrow says they were armed but never issued any ammunition(1). He adds that they were briefly attached, in March 1945, to 11. Nordland on a quiet spot in the East, but that when that unit was moved to Berlin for the final battle, the British were specifically excluded. He concludes that maybe one or two of these men refused to be withdrawn and voluntereed personally to stay on, and were in all likelihood killed in Berlin; there is no evidence that they were indeed ordered or allowed to fight.

Those one or two were probably the real British Nazis in the sorry outfit. Maybe a few more were fanatical anti-Communists; Windrow says many of the rest were "near-morons", easily taken advantage of; and maybe a few were just seduced by better living conditions, better food, and sexual opportunities. It's really possible that it was so, given that they weren't hung wholesale; only ringleaders were, the others were sentenced to prison terms.

(1) so much for the notion that they "fought".
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  #32  
Old 12 Oct 17, 20:03
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What they did must be viewed as treason.
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  #33  
Old 15 Oct 17, 22:34
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Originally Posted by Merkava188 View Post
What they did must be viewed as treason.
Exactly. No excuse can cover such an act. lcm1
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  #34  
Old 15 Oct 17, 23:12
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The British made sure that "Lord Haw Haw" was hung and he had not been a British subject for ten years. These "volunteers" should have gotten the same treatment.

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  #35  
Old 17 Oct 17, 13:59
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Well it was not only Brits whom stood for the Axis cause during WW2 but also Americans including prominent members of society such as Ezra Pound,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ezra_Pound

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_Chandler

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_W._Kaltenbach

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axis_Sally

The Third Reich's version of national socialism was once extremely popular among Europeans and also had a steady gaining in the UK and USA into the late 1930s reaching tens of thousands of American and British followers. Inevitably when the UK declared war on Germany in 1939 only the most fanatical American and British Reich supporters such as the Brits who fought for Hitler remained committed to Germany. But certainly if it was not for the British and Germans going to war with each other in 39..The Reichs political ideologies may have grown in the UK and USA but also the ideals of Democracy and freedom may have grown in Germany.

I also believe that had any American or British man committed to the German cause...been captured early in WW2 that the punishments would not be as harsh as they were for men like John Amery or William Joyce. In the Spring and Summer of 1945 the allied forces were seeing more and more of the extents of the German crimes and it seems the public that is in the Soviet Union, USA, and England wanted justice or what some might say is revenge and so therefore men like Amery and Joyce were executed by the allied forces for the reason of committing treason. It would have been understandable in the spring and summer of 1945 for the allied populations of the world to want to execute any Americans, Soviets, or Brits whom served the Third Reich although their have always been those whom are opposed to the death penalty on religious or other grounds. All these years later maybe a very long prison sentence would have done for folks like John Amery, William Joyce and Axis Sally.

Apparently men like Amery or Joyce had not renounced their US and UK citizenship where as other collaborators like the American lady Axis Sally had actually renounced her American citizenship and therefore could not be tried for treason by an allied court. Axis Sally was an American whom like William Joyce served the Axis cause during WW2.. But perhaps Axis Sally was spared her life not only due to her renouncing her US citizenship, but also because she was a woman and in some of the Christian European societies it would have been an unwelcome sight to execute a lady.
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  #36  
Old 18 Oct 17, 05:55
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What they did must be viewed as treason.
It was. I think I did mention trials after the war.
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  #37  
Old 22 Oct 17, 03:29
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I remember just after Germany surrendered the P.M. of Ireland paid a visit to the German embassy in Dublin to express his condolences for Hitler's death and yet he didn't go to the American embassy to pay his respects when Roosevelt 2 weeks before Hitler blew his brains out.
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  #38  
Old 22 Oct 17, 07:58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merkava188 View Post
I remember just after Germany surrendered the P.M. of Ireland paid a visit to the German embassy in Dublin to express his condolences for Hitler's death and yet he didn't go to the American embassy to pay his respects when Roosevelt 2 weeks before Hitler blew his brains out.
It was actually just before the surrender and he signed the book of condolences at the German embassy. The Irish republicans had been sympathetic to Fascism from its earliest days - formally recognising the State of Fume set up by General Gabriele D'Annunzio, Prince of Montenevoso and his Blackshirts when the rest of Europe (with the exception of the Bolsheviks) were either condemning it or trying to ignore it.
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  #39  
Old 22 Oct 17, 13:17
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I get the feeling that the OP would have gladly turncoated for Nazi Germany... not as a soldat... no... too bloody dangerous, and he would probably have been killed by his own first chance they got, but as a voice for Herr Gobbles.

Can we just get rid of this nasty troll? He adds nothing, but yet takes away so much. He is one of the reasons I rarely post here these days, and if I was reading and thinking of signing up, then he would be the number one reason I wouldn't.

Take a look around. How many good posters have gone since this nasty person began sucking the air out of the forum?

Sigh. If I have to take a warning or booting over this, then so be it, but the longer this Stormfront wolf in sheep's clothing is here, then the quicker this place will be a memory.
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  #40  
Old 22 Oct 17, 13:23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rojik View Post
I get the feeling that the OP would have gladly turncoated for Nazi Germany... not as a soldat... no... too bloody dangerous, and he would probably have been killed by his own first chance they got, but as a voice for Herr Gobbles.

Can we just get rid of this nasty troll? He adds nothing, but yet takes away so much. He is one of the reasons I rarely post here these days, and if I was reading and thinking of signing up, then he would be the number one reason I wouldn't.

Take a look around. How many good posters have gone since this nasty person began sucking the air out of the forum?

Sigh. If I have to take a warning or booting over this, then so be it, but the longer this Stormfront wolf in sheep's clothing is here, then the quicker this place will be a memory.
Oh wow someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed.
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  #41  
Old 22 Oct 17, 13:31
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Originally Posted by Stonewall_Jack View Post
Oh wow someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed.
I know you. Probably better than you know yourself. Now this is the last thing I will say to you.

I will talk about you and call you out on your (oh so carefully planned) hate speech, but I will not talk to you. There are rats in sewers that are worth more of my time and energy than scum like you.

Respond as you want. It won't be answered.
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  #42  
Old 22 Oct 17, 13:41
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I know you.
Did not read any further after you wrote this. I dont know who you are, but I have been around the block long enough to be able to deal with people like you who launch personal attacks against any topics they perceive to be wrong in any sort of fashion. Maybe go live in North Korea or a Third Reich type setting if you think you can intimidate other people. Other then that any more personal attacks by you or any post of yours with any type of rude language will not get any response from me.
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  #43  
Old 22 Oct 17, 14:09
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What surprises me is that everyone seems to have overlooked Norman Baillie-Stewart who was originally Court Martialed in 1933 for supplying material to Germany, stripped of his commission and served five years as the last state prisoner in the Tower of London. In 1939 he was in Berlin and was employed to broadcast to Britain. He was the original Lord Haw Haw being later supplanted in the role by Joyce . Captured in Vienna in 1945 he was sent to England to be tried for treason but Labour Party Attorney-General, Hartley Shawcross prosecuted him for the lesser offence Committing an act likely to assist the enemy to which he pleaded guilty. Why he was not treated in the same manner as Joyce is a mystery - he had not even the shred of a legal defence to treason that Joyce claimed. After serving five years (in Dartmoor I think) he moved to Dublin
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  #44  
Old 26 Oct 17, 20:58
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Who in Britain would ever want to fight for the Nazis? During this summer Bolt Action games had a hypothetical campaign where the Germans actually carried out Sea Lion and the IRA and other pro Nazi groups in Britain were factor in this scenario.
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Old 27 Oct 17, 07:17
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Who in Britain would ever want to fight for the Nazis? During this summer Bolt Action games had a hypothetical campaign where the Germans actually carried out Sea Lion and the IRA and other pro Nazi groups in Britain were factor in this scenario.
Ah the old 5th column myth
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