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Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Current Events > Russia, Central Asia, and The Caucasus

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Russia, Central Asia, and The Caucasus Post-Soviet Russia and some neglected smaller neighbors.

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  #1  
Old 16 Sep 17, 09:41
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Ukraine adopts discriminatory school law

Ukraine's new school law sparks concern in Poland, Hungary and Romania.

Hungary says Ukraine’s new school law hurts minority rights

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...=.319f1dd6ff7d
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  #2  
Old 19 Sep 17, 04:14
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“We consider the new education law approved by the Ukrainian parliament to be shameful and disgraceful,” Szijjarto said. “This law — in a manner incompatible with European values and laws — drastically limits the access of minorities, including the Hungarian community, to education in the mother tongue.”
Who would have thought the Hungarians were such lovers of European values and laws
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Old 19 Sep 17, 07:00
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There are 50 countries in Europe, different peoples, different languages, different cultures, and different values and laws. This statement of "incompatible with European values and laws" is such a BS statement. To begin with, Europe is NOT a country but a continent. Clearly this must have escaped Szijjarto.

Besides, these people are all guests in the host nation in which they reside and they only have the "rights" the host nation give them.

You don't enter someones house as a guest and start making demands.

As for "studying" their own mother tongue they can do that at home, as in using the their native tongue. They can't expect the host nation to provide them with the opportunity to do so. Their parents can give them books to read in their native tongue, and at an early age, problem solved. All that's required is that you are a parent!!

Entitled minorities all over the place these days, if ethnic Hungarians don't like it in Ukraine they should move back home to their native land. If they don't wanna assimilate (which I both understand and respect, we are all tribal - and for good reason - and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that) they should move back home.

That simple.
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Old 19 Sep 17, 07:06
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It's the same old nationalistic BS.

Our nationalism good, their nationalism bad.

Expect someone to come along and tell us Ukraine isn't actually a nation soon.
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Old 19 Sep 17, 09:02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walle View Post
...these people are all guests in the host nation in which they reside and they only have the "rights" the host nation give them.

You don't enter someones house as a guest and start making demands.
I was unaware that ethnic Hungarians, Poles and Romanians were "guests" in the Ukraine. Pray tell, when did they arrive in the country called Ukraine?
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Old 19 Sep 17, 12:24
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The area in question has been home to these ethnic minorities for many years. Hungary once owned it. The Soviets gave it to the Ukraine after WWII. The US has taught English only in its High Schools for a long time. My ex-wife's first language was French and she was punished for using it at school.

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  #7  
Old 19 Sep 17, 14:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walle View Post
There are 50 countries in Europe, different peoples, different languages, different cultures, and different values and laws. This statement of "incompatible with European values and laws" is such a BS statement. To begin with, Europe is NOT a country but a continent. Clearly this must have escaped Szijjarto.

Besides, these people are all guests in the host nation in which they reside and they only have the "rights" the host nation give them.

You don't enter someones house as a guest and start making demands.

As for "studying" their own mother tongue they can do that at home, as in using the their native tongue. They can't expect the host nation to provide them with the opportunity to do so. Their parents can give them books to read in their native tongue, and at an early age, problem solved. All that's required is that you are a parent!!

Entitled minorities all over the place these days, if ethnic Hungarians don't like it in Ukraine they should move back home to their native land. If they don't wanna assimilate (which I both understand and respect, we are all tribal - and for good reason - and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that) they should move back home.

That simple.
You clearly haven't heard about the European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages and the Framework Convention for the Protection of National Minorities.
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Old 19 Sep 17, 19:57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imperial View Post
Ukraine's new school law sparks concern in Poland, Hungary and Romania.

Hungary says Ukraine’s new school law hurts minority rights

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...=.319f1dd6ff7d
After decades of forcing them to speak Russian and trying to suppress the Ukrainian language the Ukrainians are probably paranoid. I don't approve but I understand.
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Old 20 Sep 17, 15:37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonsterZero View Post
After decades of forcing them to speak Russian and trying to suppress the Ukrainian language
Actually the other way around. Google "Ukrainization, 1920s". As far as education is concerned "by the end of 1980s in school system about the same number of students were educated on Ukrainian and on Russian"
In the present time Russian is a way more commonly used in unofficial and private spheres (except former Polish Ukraine). For example Russian is by far the preferred language on websites in Ukraine (80.1%), followed by English (10.1%), then Ukrainian (9.5%).
Which makes efforts on enforced Ukrainization somewhat schizophrenic.
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Old 22 Sep 17, 15:24
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It's been in the news here that the Romanian president talked with Poroshenko at the UNGA and told him he'll cancel his scheduled visit to Ukraine because of this decision. BTW, Poroshenko speaks Romanian.
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Old 26 Sep 17, 17:14
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Hungarian Foreign Ministry announced today that Hungary will now endeavour to impede any further EU-Ukraine integration plans
Quote:
Hungary's Minister of Foreign Affairs and Trade Peter Szijjarto has announced that his country will block any Ukrainian steps within the European Union after Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko has signed a notorious education law that critics say will infringe on the rights of ethnic minorities.

"Hungary will block all steps within the European Union that would represent a step forward in Ukraine's European integration process in the spirit of the Eastern Partnership program," he said in a statement posted on the ministry's website on Tuesday, September 26. "We can guarantee that all this will be painful for Ukraine in future," he added. According to Mr. Szijjarto, it is "shameful and outrageous" that the Ukrainian president has signed the education act.

Until now, President Poroshenko had spoken about the fact that the wants to take Ukraine closer to Europe, but with the decision "he has moved further away from Europe and taken a huge step in the opposite direction," Szijjarto said. Poroshenko has until now spoken about a European Ukraine, he continued, "but this is something he can now forget about to all intents and purposes" in view of the fact that Hungary will be blocking all initiatives that could be favorable for Ukraine at all possible forums and all international organizations, and primarily within the EU.

Now that the association agreement between the EU and Ukraine and the agreement on visa-free travel for Ukrainian citizens have been concluded, Ukraine is "nurturing the hope" that they will now be able to take further steps along the road to European integration. "Well that's something they can now forget about," the Minister of Foreign Affairs and Trade declared.
https://www.unian.info/politics/2155...r-ukraine.html
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Old 27 Sep 17, 07:35
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The Maidan chickens are coming to their EU supporters' roost.
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Old 29 Sep 17, 16:57
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Quote:
Ukrainian Foreign Minister Pavlo Klimkin has recalled Ukrainian Ambassador to Hungary Liubov Nepop in connection with the Hungarian authorities’ reaction to the law on education, which has taken effect in Ukraine, specifically, its article dealing with the language of instruction.
https://www.kyivpost.com/ukraine-pol...education.html
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Old 27 Oct 17, 17:24
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Hungary vetoes Ukraine-NATO summit:
https://en.lb.ua/news/2017/10/27/477...toukraine.html
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Old 29 Oct 17, 07:40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imperial View Post
You clearly haven't heard about the European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages and the Framework Convention for the Protection of National Minorities.
Did the Ukraine sign that?
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