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Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Historical Events & Eras > American Age of Discovery, Colonization, Revolution, & Expansion > American Age of Formative Expansion

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American Age of Formative Expansion 1789-1830 To begin with the 1st US President & extend through the Whiskey Rebellion, Quasi War with France, War of 1812, & southeastern Indian wars,

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  #1  
Old 06 Oct 15, 06:42
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Taieb el-Okbi Taieb el-Okbi is offline
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Frederick Douglass on Ireland

Eleven days and a half gone and I have crossed three thousand miles of the perilous deep. Instead of a democratic government, I am under a monarchical government. Instead of the bright, blue sky of America, I am covered with the soft, grey fog of the Emerald Isle [Ireland]. I breathe, and lo! the chattel [slave] becomes a man. I gaze around in vain for one who will question my equal humanity, claim me as his slave, or offer me an insult. I employ a cab—I am seated beside white people—I reach the hotel—I enter the same door—I am shown into the same parlour—I dine at the same table—and no one is offended... I find myself regarded and treated at every turn with the kindness and deference paid to white people. When I go to church, I am met by no upturned nose and scornful lip to tell me, * '​We don't allow niggers in here!* 


https://books.google.com/books?id=nO...20deep&f=false
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  #2  
Old 06 Oct 15, 07:40
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Drusus Nero Drusus Nero is offline
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Mr. el-Okbi....

I am a litle surprised that you post this without offering some commentary of your own.

I am an admirer of Douglas, and in due course, I will plough my way through this...(later, because I do have to pick up my daughter in a short time).

It's nice to have something to read direct from Frederick himself. But I do wonder whether this is considered to be part of the Civil War forum? Yes?

Or no...it really matters not. But i do promise to give this more than a little of my attention. Study of Douglas, Garrison and other abolitionists is, in my view, essential to a proper undersanding of the American Civil War. And I do thank you for posting it.

give me a little time, and Ill comment...

But right now, it would be nice to hear YOUR views of the living phenomenon that was Douglas and his writings.

I look forward to it.
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Old 06 Oct 15, 17:52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drusus Nero View Post
Mr. el-Okbi....

I am a litle surprised that you post this without offering some commentary of your own.

I am an admirer of Douglas, and in due course, I will plough my way through this...(later, because I do have to pick up my daughter in a short time).

It's nice to have something to read direct from Frederick himself. But I do wonder whether this is considered to be part of the Civil War forum? Yes?

Or no...it really matters not. But i do promise to give this more than a little of my attention. Study of Douglas, Garrison and other abolitionists is, in my view, essential to a proper undersanding of the American Civil War. And I do thank you for posting it.

give me a little time, and Ill comment...

But right now, it would be nice to hear YOUR views of the living phenomenon that was Douglas and his writings.

I look forward to it.
Hello Drusus,

Frederick Douglass once said “I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong". <--This, along with other things that Douglass said and did is why I view Douglass in a positive fashion.
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Old 06 Oct 15, 21:19
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Dear Taieb,

I think what jumps off the page, more than anything, is Douglases natural elquance. He uses langquage that was not even in the common usage of the day. It's very 'clipped english". I think this is a Massuchessets manner? or bostonian speech? either way, it certainly does not sound like the fiction of the day, the florid language, full of syllables and sentiment. I have read 'Uncle Tom's Cabin" and to call it melodrama would not be an understatement. But the language used was overly done, as I'm sure conversational English was at the time.

If you read Jane austen, the same language flows. Over sylabblized, using sentiments that have more to do with proving the politeness and breeding of the writer than anything else.

Douglas does none of this. I'm guessing his wrtitten speech style is very similar to his spoken speech. He only uses compex terminology when necessary, but unfortunately, in saying the same thing over and again to his audience, (who need to have it driven home to them, again, and again, just what an evil they were perpetrating), Douglas must have appeared as a speaker of much power, and no less eloquence.

When I saw the Ken Burns documentary, the first episode had a snapshot of douglas. the commentary said that "Douglas was so eloquent that dtractors questioned whether in fact he had been a slave at all."

I'm sure this reflects that for the majority of douglases audience, they had not EVER encountered a black man that could use the english language as some of the more educated people in their ranks. the shock of this alone must have rocked them to the core, and then to have their entire society held up as an example of impiety and pure evil, that would have sent them home either converted to the cause, or with grim determination to not let anyone of that color read another book in their lifetimes!

I still haven't worked my way through all this, but if you can drag up something written by Douglas from a time closer to the civil War, or in America at least, ill be the first to reply.

christopher
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Old 09 Oct 15, 06:46
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Hi Christopher,

Another reason I respect Douglass is due to the admiration that Douglass received from all sorts of people..Douglass was impressed and respected by not only the people of Ireland but Douglass also received respect from folks here in the USA.

And so, on Aug. 10, Douglass went to the White House, accompanied by Samuel C. Pomeroy, the Radical Republican senator from Kansas. First they stopped at the War Department to meet with Secretary of War Edwin M. Stanton. Like most people, Douglass found Stanton “cold and business-like,” but nonetheless sympathetic. Over the course of a half-hour meeting, Stanton offered his assurance that he favored equal treatment for the United States Colored Troops, particularly regarding the inflammatory issue of equal pay, and that he had put forth legislation, rejected by Congress, to remedy the inequity. Stanton also offered Douglass a military commission so that he might assist Gen. Lorenzo Thomas in his efforts to recruit blacks in Mississippi.

....

The impact of the meeting between Lincoln and Douglass was largely personal. Douglass was “not entirely satisfied with his views,” but “was so well satisfied with the man … that I determined to go on with the recruiting.

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com...s-met-lincoln/

Thats what I would term as getting the ball moving.
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Old 09 Oct 15, 11:58
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During the Antebellum era some White Southern preachers would talk about how a slave ought listen to his master in order to get into heaven.Douglass was also a Christian whom correctly pointed out that owning slaves went against the teachings of Christ.
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Old 10 Oct 15, 10:24
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Talk to ya tomorrow, Taieb...I just lost a mamoth post, so i'll leave it for another day...sorry...this is an interesting thread with bells on, but i've just had enough for one night.

Salam, and may God be with you.
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