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  #256  
Old 29 Apr 12, 12:00
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Originally Posted by G David Bock View Post
The map here illustrates clearly that Martin had to be lurking to ambush Zimmerman as it's clear Martin could have evaded (may have needed to sprint) had he wished;
http://www.wagist.com/2012/dan-lineh...n-doubled-back
Will I need to lead you by the hand, step by step, thru the sequence of events to make it clear?
or that zimmerman got out of his car and hollered hey get over here

also your map shows zimmerman following still after being told not to. and for a good ways afterwards

i can make up scnearios with the best of em.

End result Zimmeran as the agressor is not allowed to escalate the scale of force unless you want someone who is robbing you to be able to shoot you when you pull a bat on them because they are claiming self defense.
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  #257  
Old 29 Apr 12, 13:45
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Originally Posted by craven View Post
he was already chasing him which means he would of kept on chasing him and how do we know zimmerman just did not run up and confront him rather than martin lurking
"CHASING HIM"? Man, you got a million dollar story on all kinds of network news if you can prove that.

Last verifiable word I heard is "Following", which is a whole lot different than chasing.
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  #258  
Old 29 Apr 12, 14:00
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Originally Posted by craven View Post
End result Zimmeran as the agressor is not allowed to escalate the scale of force unless you want someone who is robbing you to be able to shoot you when you pull a bat on them because they are claiming self defense.
If possible, I will escalate force if someone is trying to crush my skull against the pavement. If you want to just lay there and get killed, that's your right and that's fine with me.
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  #259  
Old 29 Apr 12, 15:15
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Originally Posted by Hida Akechi View Post
If possible, I will escalate force if someone is trying to crush my skull against the pavement. If you want to just lay there and get killed, that's your right and that's fine with me.
i wouldnt of gotten out of the car.


and you should go to jail because of the actions you took it would be forsee able that a conflict would occurr.
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  #260  
Old 29 Apr 12, 15:16
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Originally Posted by Trailboss49 View Post
"CHASING HIM"? Man, you got a million dollar story on all kinds of network news if you can prove that.

Last verifiable word I heard is "Following", which is a whole lot different than chasing.
they said Martin lurked so i used chase amazing how one word changes the scenario
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  #261  
Old 29 Apr 12, 18:04
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i wouldnt of gotten out of the car.


and you should go to jail because of the actions you took it would be forsee able that a conflict would occurr.
It isn't against the law to get out of your car and do everything that happened up to the point of the physical confrontation and the scuffle that led to the shooting*.

If Zimmerman was attacked, he had the right to defend himself. If not, then we'll see what this court is going to decide. Innocence or guilt, you should be happy that Zimmerman is going to be killed someday for this.

Unless you were there in person or can prove that you have some sort of paranormal remote-viewing ability and saw the whole thing go down, I wouldn't be too quick to jump to judgement like you are. Leave that up to the media and black racists and their allies.

*So, if someone invades your home, and you are forced to kill them, then its your fault for getting out of bed to see what is happening in your front room that late at night?
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  #262  
Old 29 Apr 12, 19:53
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Originally Posted by Hida Akechi View Post
It isn't against the law to get out of your car and do everything that happened up to the point of the physical confrontation and the scuffle that led to the shooting*.

If Zimmerman was attacked, he had the right to defend himself. If not, then we'll see what this court is going to decide. Innocence or guilt, you should be happy that Zimmerman is going to be killed someday for this.

Unless you were there in person or can prove that you have some sort of paranormal remote-viewing ability and saw the whole thing go down, I wouldn't be too quick to jump to judgement like you are. Leave that up to the media and black racists and their allies.

*So, if someone invades your home, and you are forced to kill them, then its your fault for getting out of bed to see what is happening in your front room that late at night?
True, regardless of what happened before the physical incident took place, We do not know how the the final phase started, did Martin confront Zimmerman as he was going back to his truck? Did they run into each other at some point, and so on.
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  #263  
Old 29 Apr 12, 20:35
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this guy has his own opinions but he has a couple maps with diagrams that are worthwhile


http://statelymcdanielmanor.wordpres...tive-analysis/


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  #264  
Old 29 Apr 12, 21:59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hida Akechi View Post
It isn't against the law to get out of your car and do everything that happened up to the point of the physical confrontation and the scuffle that led to the shooting*.

If Zimmerman was attacked, he had the right to defend himself. If not, then we'll see what this court is going to decide. Innocence or guilt, you should be happy that Zimmerman is going to be killed someday for this.

Unless you were there in person or can prove that you have some sort of paranormal remote-viewing ability and saw the whole thing go down, I wouldn't be too quick to jump to judgement like you are. Leave that up to the media and black racists and their allies.

*So, if someone invades your home, and you are forced to kill them, then its your fault for getting out of bed to see what is happening in your front room that late at night?
I just pointing out zimmerman could be viewed as the agressor. Overall for me the fact that zimmerman behaved the way I would suspect someone who going to attack me I giving Martin that same benfit. The arguement could also be made Martin seeing someone suspicious like zimmerman doubled back to see if Zimmerman was stealing something.

the answer to your question is no but on the otherhand if you use a bat and he shoots you dead according to arguements here he could claim self defense. which is what zimmermans defense is going to argue.
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  #265  
Old 30 Apr 12, 06:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hida Akechi View Post
It isn't against the law to get out of your car and do everything that happened up to the point of the physical confrontation and the scuffle that led to the shooting*.

If Zimmerman was attacked, he had the right to defend himself. If not, then we'll see what this court is going to decide. Innocence or guilt, you should be happy that Zimmerman is going to be killed someday for this.

I will give you my take on how I think the prosecutor is going to play it,,,


the fact that Zimmerman is armed and got out of his car to look for Martin is where Zimmerman shows his malice... for 2nd degree they don't have to show intent, just malice.

the malice comes in when Zimmerman saw the guy, assumed the guy was suspicious or doing something wrong and then exited his vehicle and followed or attempted to follow the suspicious guy...

the argument that Zimmerman has a right to get out of his car loses steam as soon as you realize he got out of his car to look for somebody who is now dead..

its not like Zimmerman got out of his car to walk to the clubhouse or to get his mail etc.... he got out of his car to look for a man who he moments later shot dead..

anyway, that is my take on how the prosecutor is going to play it..
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  #266  
Old 30 Apr 12, 21:14
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Martin should have just gone home.... instead he circles back to confront Zimmerman. Who is the aggressor?
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  #267  
Old 30 Apr 12, 21:45
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this guy has his own opinions but he has a couple maps with diagrams that are worthwhile


http://statelymcdanielmanor.wordpres...tive-analysis/


Which illustrate the point I made earlier, that Martin could have hustled "home free" and no confrontation would have occurred.

Zimmerman thought "the suspect" was leaving the complex, so headed on the eastward path to the other street, and was at 'blue triangle' by time dispatcher asks if Zimmerman is following and asks that he not do such. In returning to his vehicle, Zimmerman may have seen Martin going down the southerly path between the rows of condos, BUT...

At night and raining, Martin should have been at least halfway home, or further if he was hustling that way to get out of weather and enjoy his skittles and iced tea. Instead we have an encounter very near the intersections of the paths, would would suggest that either Martin didn't hustle home, or doubled back, or chose to lurk to confront.

The chronology in the background links I presented earlier here indict that in prior events Zimmerman wasn't in any rush to deal with/confront suspects. And having seen them "get away" in past before the police arrived, sounds like he was only tailing to see where this "suspect" was going.

Martin had a head start on going down the paths and would have gained a further lead on the southerly course when Zimmerman went east, so by the time Zimmerman gets back to the intersection of paths, Martin should have been past the first building and well ahead of Zimmerman, and distance from the "confrontation site", IF he was truely innocent and just strolling home from the store.

The movement dynamics here strongly suggest that Martin was the one whom sought out an encounter/confrontation. Which leans towards Zimmerman's account of being sucker punched and then pounced upon by Martin.

I'll admit that if I were in Zimmerman's position, after having my head banged a couple of times into the concrete, I'd be at basic instinct of survival level and would draw and fire. Difference being I usually practice doing double and triple taps so likely wouldn't have shot once like Zimmerman. I'd want to make sure my assailant was down and done, if his karma gets recycled, them's the breaks.
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  #268  
Old 30 Apr 12, 22:56
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Which illustrate the point I made earlier, that Martin could have hustled "home free" and no confrontation would have occurred.

Zimmerman thought "the suspect" was leaving the complex, so headed on the eastward path to the other street, and was at 'blue triangle' by time dispatcher asks if Zimmerman is following and asks that he not do such. In returning to his vehicle, Zimmerman may have seen Martin going down the southerly path between the rows of condos, BUT...

At night and raining, Martin should have been at least halfway home, or further if he was hustling that way to get out of weather and enjoy his skittles and iced tea. Instead we have an encounter very near the intersections of the paths, would would suggest that either Martin didn't hustle home, or doubled back, or chose to lurk to confront.

The chronology in the background links I presented earlier here indict that in prior events Zimmerman wasn't in any rush to deal with/confront suspects. And having seen them "get away" in past before the police arrived, sounds like he was only tailing to see where this "suspect" was going.

Martin had a head start on going down the paths and would have gained a further lead on the southerly course when Zimmerman went east, so by the time Zimmerman gets back to the intersection of paths, Martin should have been past the first building and well ahead of Zimmerman, and distance from the "confrontation site", IF he was truely innocent and just strolling home from the store.

The movement dynamics here strongly suggest that Martin was the one whom sought out an encounter/confrontation. Which leans towards Zimmerman's account of being sucker punched and then pounced upon by Martin.

I'll admit that if I were in Zimmerman's position, after having my head banged a couple of times into the concrete, I'd be at basic instinct of survival level and would draw and fire. Difference being I usually practice doing double and triple taps so likely wouldn't have shot once like Zimmerman. I'd want to make sure my assailant was down and done, if his karma gets recycled, them's the breaks.
um so a black kid can not walk around and clear his head for a bit is your arguement. he has to hustle along long home or be shot i know i being simplistic but that what your arguement is.

also zimmerman did not go back to his truck directly but instead set out to engage Martin since he did not follow his direct path to his truck. once again just saying. the movement dynamic is more damming of zimmerman that martin.
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  #269  
Old 01 May 12, 00:22
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um so a black kid can not walk around and clear his head for a bit is your arguement. he has to hustle along long home or be shot i know i being simplistic but that what your arguement is.

also zimmerman did not go back to his truck directly but instead set out to engage Martin since he did not follow his direct path to his truck. once again just saying. the movement dynamic is more damming of zimmerman that martin.
If the routes are correct then why didn't Martin go directly home? It makes little sense unless he wanted to bash Zimmerman's head in.
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  #270  
Old 01 May 12, 08:36
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If the routes are correct then why didn't Martin go directly home? It makes little sense unless he wanted to bash Zimmerman's head in.
Maybe he wanted to ask this possible pervert/robber why he was stalking him?
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