German-Soviet Pact Known? Or Secret?

[Przemyslaw]

Talking maps:

That's colored one from 28th September 1939. Some corrections was made so Georeing could have good hunting spots near Lubaczow. From German archives:



Stalin really loved drawings. One below is from 1944:

[Imperial]

Originally Posted by Exorcist

What I am saying here is that this was a huge item in itself, and they way the other guys are dancing around it is like.... it's like slapping down an Ace and the guy you are playing cards says "no, it's hindsight. hindsight. hindsight I tell you. HIND-SIGHT!"

Or that.

[stalin]

German-Soviet Pact Known? Or Secret?

german-british-american pact known or secret ?

[skoblin]

Originally Posted by stalin

german-british-american pact known or secret ?

I'm sorry....those records are permanently sealed....

[Kunikov]

Originally Posted by skoblin

I'm sorry....those records are permanently sealed....

Indeed, just ask the British about Hess.

[Exorcist]

Originally Posted by stalin

german-british-american pact known or secret ?

:cheek y:

Would you like a beenie to go with that tin-foil hat?

I lost track, what stage are htey at here.... confusion, anger, denial... what's the rest of it?
You can bet your first born that these die-hards will never get to acceptance, ain't gonna happen.

[stalin]

Originally Posted by Exorcist

Would you like a beenie to go with that tin-foil hat?

but there undoubtedly should have been a pact between nazi germany and the west since the nazi attitude towards us russians doesnt differ from that of the west.

[copenhagen]

Originally Posted by stalin

but there undoubtedly should have been a pact between nazi germany and the west since the nazi attitude towards us russians doesnt differ from that of the west.

Oh this old chestnut from the east again. And its cobblers to boot!! Change the record dude.

[pawelj]

Originally Posted by skoblin

What a brilliant rendering of international law. It is alright if you seize chunks of another country's territory - as long as you don't take too much. I presume, then, you would have no problem if Germany took back Stettin.

What International Law? . While Stettin could be considered German historically, due to German aggression in WW2 its claim is forfeit. Zaolzie had a majority Polish population in 1938. And Poland did not made massive arrests, deportation and killings in the acquired areas. It was part of Czechoslovakia as a result of aggression in 1920. If you think Germany is entitle to Stettin so then Poland is entitled to Zaolzie now, and Lwow, and Wilno, and Grodno. Don't even try compare the action of Poland and the Soviets, it shows your total ignorance of history. In 1938-9 Poland was not interested in war, Germany and Soviet Union were.

[Kunikov]

Originally Posted by pawelj

What International Law? . While Stettin could be considered German historically, due to German aggression in WW2 its claim is forfeit. Zaolzie had a majority Polish population in 1938. And Poland did not made massive arrests, deportation and killings in the acquired areas. It was part of Czechoslovakia as a result of aggression in 1920. If you think Germany is entitle to Stettin so then Poland is entitled to Zaolzie now, and Lwow, and Wilno, and Grodno. Don't even try compare the action of Poland and the Soviets, it shows your total ignorance of history. In 1938-9 Poland was not interested in war, Germany and Soviet Union were.

The Soviet Union was interested in containing Hitler's Germany and averting something greater than a minor skirmish, unlike that of Poland, who could only hope the Western Allies would do something, anything, while partaking in the dismemberment of Czechoslovakia and antagonizing their eastern neighbor.

[Carl Schwamberg]

Originally Posted by stalin

but there undoubtedly should have been a pact between nazi germany and the west since the nazi attitude towards us russians doesnt differ from that of the west.

Or not. Pro facists or pro Germans amoung the US leaders were balanced by older pro Russians and younger leftists, anti facists, or pragmatists. The efforts by ambassador Davis in the later 1930s to reach understandings or agreements with the Soviet government was seen as a threat by the nazis of Germany and evidence of probable secret agreements between the US & USSR. I'm not expert enough to identify any actual secret agreements between the US & USSR between 1933 & 1941, perhaps there were none. My point is Roosevelts policy was complex & definitly not so profacist or pro German that such things with Germany would be very likely either. One of the objections to Roosevelts forigen policy by the conservatives or was that he refused to seek clearly defined agreements supporting Germanys anti Communist policy.

I'll leave to the Brits to comment on the British policies towards the USSR & Germany in that era.

[Heidi]

Originally Posted by stalin

but there undoubtedly should have been a pact between nazi germany and the west since the nazi attitude towards us russians doesnt differ from that of the west.

Did you nott heard that the britisch rejected the germans? & nott all western allies hitler was fonde of,the french for some reason Hitler disliked.
The only country that belived in hitlers invasion of europe was russia,this ist why russia and germany ended up in a sghn pact,in othr words,hitler was just using russia cause hitler could nott gett the britsch to side withe germany.

[Henry Woods]

World War II has always been an interesting subject, especially from the point of view of the secrets and spies. One such pact was the German-Soviet Pact. This was also known as the Ribbentrop-Molotov Pact named after the two foreign ministers who negotiated the agreement. There is evidence that the pact was no secret and that information about it went to C. Hull from von Herwath. Hull later on passed it to Halifax and G. Bonnet. The Pact enabled Germany to attack Poland on September 1, 1939, without fear of Soviet intervention. Try shmoop.com for more interesting guidelines on this fascinating subject.